Judson on a 25-30 HP? · International Vintage Volkswagen Forums

vintagevw
pre67vw Junkie Topic Starter

14 years ago

#1

Does someone have experience with it?
The good, the bad...
Thanks for your help guys. :beer:

Wat is het fijn om lesbisch te zijn!

Rhodrich
Regular

14 years ago

#2

I had a Judson on my split bug which had a 30hp engine fitted. Not sure I'd ever go back to a stock 30hp now.

It changes the whole character of the engine, from being slow but dependable, to something that will keep up with modern traffic. MPG doesn't go down too much either, and I didn't notice the engine getting any hotter than without it.

I'm not sure I'd supercharge a 25hp though. It does put more strain on the engine, and 25hp parts are starting to get pretty scarce if something does break. I kept my original 25hp engine in the garage......

The only other downside is that the engine is quite a bit noisier with the supercharger - it makes quite a loud whirring sound.

brille52
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#3

We are making some updates on the Red Cross,four door, Papler and I always had in mind, to put a Judson ( I have a complete one ) ) into the car.
Now, after days of hot discussions,the decision is made : we will N O T mount it.
Was that a good decision ? :?

a8)

Ps.Can someone give me some info on the number plate ? Would be GREAT, Thanks !! Papler Zwischenstand 014.jpg You have insufficient rights to see the content.

Edited by user 14 years ago | Reason: Not specified

zelensis61
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#4

We are making some updates on the Red Cross,four door, Papler and I always had in mind, to put a Judson ( I have a complete one ) ) into the car.
Now, after days of hot discussions,the decision is made : we will N O T mount it.
Was that a good decision ? :? YES

a8)

Ps.Can someone give me some info on the number plate ? Would be GREAT, Thanks !!

brille52 wrote:

NO, Sorry Sir. Servus. Maybe the German guys can help.

ZELENSIS, coachbuilt body from the 50's on a vw platform made in Belgium. Peter the heb detective

JD
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#5

AB is (I think!) Amerikanische Bayern, so American occupied Bavaria, as it was under American control after the war.

"John, you need to get a grip and STOP MOANING AT EVERYTHING. ThumbDown "

zehbeh
Regular

14 years ago

#6

Ps.Can someone give me some info on the number plate ? Would be GREAT, Thanks !!

brille52 wrote:

These license plates are called "Besatzungskennzeichen".
AB means Amerikanische Zone Bayern (as James already wrote).
More about this here (in german, sorry): Besatzungskennzeichen

oval56
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#7

i had a judson on my 30hp engine for a while, and i would not do it again....

it is a nice thing for a display, but not for use....

if you do not use the higer power permanent it might work, if you use it frequently to push the gaspedal or to be faster on the autobahn... wrong thing to play.

www.oval56.de
www.oval56.com

DBK Germany

lifeintheslowlane
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#8

i had a judson on my 30hp engine for a while, and i would not do it again....

it is a nice thing for a display, but not for use....

if you do not use the higer power permanent it might work, if you use it frequently to push the gaspedal or to be faster on the autobahn... wrong thing to play.

oval56 wrote:

Yes Andi likes to extend the range of the 30hp and of course there's nothing wrong with that but with the Judson you have to understand what it was designed to do and for whom the original kit was aimed.

The Judson Kit was aimed not at the motorsport enthusiast but the average VW owner who wanted to make everyday driving of their underpowered 30hp VW a little easier. They could have used a more efficient carb but that would have made it more expensive so they stuck with as many original VW parts as possible.

Judson guaranteed their kits would not break anything as long as you stuck to their installation instructions. Basically they said we have developed the kit to suit the standard unmodified 30hp engine, any changes you make to the original engine apart from adding our kit will invalidate the warranty.

Andi's problem and Peter Neilsen's were the same...running lean at high speed and this is where the Judson has a failing, not the Judson itself but the Solex carb which doesn't meter the fuel mixture consistently enough. Lean running produces extra heat and you don't want that heat in a Supercharged engine. Result?; hole in number 3 piston and burnt exhaust valve.

Time and again you see people asking forums what they can do to their 30hp engine to get more from their Judson set-up. The answers flood in and nobody mentions changing the carb.:roll:

Solution?

My driving advice if you are running a Judson is to drive your car like you are driving a 30hp...drive conservatively and it will repay you with a reliable vintage ride that is fun to use and good to look at.8)

Did Judson get it wrong? Not at all...they sold over 70,000 Kits for the VW alone...they wouldn't have done that it they ended up cremating your engine.

Edited by user 14 years ago | Reason: Not specified

John.

oval56
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#9

yes you are nearly right john, i did not burnt my valve or piston, also it was not lean after i modified the carb... my main problem was, new engine 0km, and new rebuild judson... the blow by and oiltemperature was over the top.

if i look now on thes i had also the problem with the fiat pistons i used ... the are not perfect for judsons and so on... but if i see the costs ...today i would build an ww okrasa instead of a judson... in former times ther was noch choice.. judsons are rare & expensive, but okrasa things did not pop up very often....

the thing is, if i look on gruenis setup wit the amr, this works perfect, no heat problems, no blow by problems and all build on a new engine

peter's engine was running good and long and if you look at his outcome on power now they are on same level, but now he can youse his power always :wink: :beer:

www.oval56.de
www.oval56.com

DBK Germany

brille52
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#10

Thank you very much guy`s, for your replies and "infos " !

Anyway - maybe we go on with the discussion,having some good :beer: and at the end,the Judson set up will find its way in the car......but I think,as the engine works and runs fine at the moment,I will let it be, as it is.
Zehbeh,thanks for the link !!

a8)

lifeintheslowlane
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#11

yes you are nearly right john, i did not burnt my valve or piston, also it was not lean after i modified the carb... my main problem was, new engine 0km, and new rebuild judson... the blow by and oiltemperature was over the top.

if i look now on thes i had also the problem with the fiat pistons i used ... the are not perfect for judsons and so on... but if i see the costs ...today i would build an ww okrasa instead of a judson... in former times ther was noch choice.. judsons are rare & expensive, but okrasa things did not pop up very often....

the thing is, if i look on gruenis setup wit the amr, this works perfect, no heat problems, no blow by problems and all build on a new engine

peter's engine was running good and long and if you look at his outcome on power now they are on same level, but now he can youse his power always :wink: :beer:

oval56 wrote:

Yes there are so many variables that affect supercharging. Greueni's AMR is a roots blower isn't it...they always run cooler than the vane superchargers. My Shorrock is a lot cooler than the Judson and will be perfect for me when I get my new exhaust...whenever that will be.:wink:

That's another point for cool running...a good extractor exhaust.

John.

Peter_Plade
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#12

Since my name was mentioned; I thought I better chime in :-)
Judsons are cool no doubt about it, but I have might driven mine a little to hard.
A fact is I had some problems with the motor getting to hot and when that happend I got problems with ignition knocking.
If I drove much over 110km/h in the summer the oil temperature would go up, but with my dual carb Express kit I can drive like a maniac and the oil has never come over 100celcius.
Another fact is the motor I have driven most hard ever eas my old stock motor.
I once drove 800km to Holland with maximum speed and 2 guys in it with no problem at all!

But what ever you do make sure that your ignition is set correct, that you have the correct air/fuel mixture and keep and an eye on the oil temperature, then most motors should survive no matter what vintage speed kit you put on them :d

http://vw-bluehats.blogspot.com/

oval56
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#13

..... but with my dual carb Express kit I can drive like a maniac and the oil has never come over 100celcius.
]

Peter_Plade wrote:

:shock: :lol: :beer: yes that is right, i do drive also like a maniac with my dualcarb setups...
:beer: :lol:

www.oval56.de
www.oval56.com

DBK Germany

brille52
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#14

Unfortunately ,I also drive like a maniac - thatswhy I think, our decision concerning the Judson set up was the right one ! Let`s see, if I can modify the engine in another way...:wink:
The " Red Cross " has to be QUICK !!!

a8)

pre67vw
Administration

14 years ago

#15

The " Red Cross " has to be QUICK !!!

a8)

brille52 wrote:

:lol: :lol:

Rob Amos
Happiness is a stock VW

oval56
pre67vw Junkie

14 years ago

#16

Unfortunately ,I also drive like a maniac - thatswhy I think, our decision concerning the Judson set up was the right one ! Let`s see, if I can modify the engine in another way...:wink:
The " Red Cross " has to be QUICK !!!

a8)

brille52 wrote:

no problem 356 crank, 356 rods, modified pistons, okrasa heads and go for it 🙂

www.oval56.de
www.oval56.com

DBK Germany

Bally
Regular

14 years ago

#17

A most interesting thread guys.

I'm looking to have this set up on my 56 Kab:

How do you locate the Fram oil filter? I know I will need to modify the rain drip tray on the back of my engine lid for the Judson air filter, but will I need to bear this in mind for the location of both the Fram and the oiler?

What is the recommended method of fixing these to the fire wall? I've considered rivnuts but these don't feel 'period' enough for me.

Cheers,

Dave

56ovalrhd
Regular

13 years ago

#18

I used weld nuts and Kamax bolts :-)

69project
pre67vw Junkie

13 years ago

#19

I used weld nuts and Kamax bolts :-)

56ovalrhd wrote:

wow!

Car less.....

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