Can't find the thread regarding Josef Ganz and his Standard Superior people's car, so I'm posting a new thread.

Anyway, like me, it seems that Volksworld go along with the Tatra/VW theory rather than the Joseph Ganz one. Contributor Richard Gunn, (inside back page April'15 Volksworld) clearly thinks as I do, that Ledwinka's Tatra influenced Porsche's designing of Hitler's People's Car. Gunn however is wrong on one count though, it was the Tatra 97 not the 77 (which was a huge V8 rear-engined car).:wink:

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My view, after reading the excellent Ganz book, is that it was a pool of talented designers rather than people working in isolation and being 'copied' by others. Backed up by Porsches comment of "Well, sometimes I looked over his shoulder and sometimes he looked over mine". And if Ganz' book is true, then the patents and court cases are nothing to go by (even though the patents that VW paid out on were of insignificant components, not big concepts). It was about moving the auto industry forward and producing advanced (for the time) cars, not relying on the old way of doing things.

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Don't know if it's been said before but I read some were many years ago that the engine design had something to do with Norton motor Cycles. Just thought I would throw that in to the mix.




Andy W

I wrote to the Tatra Museum sometime ago and they confirmed that Volkswagen did payout compensation to Tatra in regards to infringements regarding the T97. This is regarding certain features of their car that appeared in the Volkswagen. Volkswagen paid Tatra 3,000,000 Deutsche Mark, even back then this is not a huge amount of money admittedly, but substantial enough none the less to indicate to me anyway, that the Tatra certainly influenced Porsche enabling him to meet Hitler's demands in a limited timescale.:mellow:

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The settlement that VW paid was such a small amount that it's really good proof that Porsche didn't steal anything of any significance.

Much of what went into the Beetle had been seen before (backbone chassis, rear Aircooled engine) and had been seen before the T97 as well. Plus who's to say that the patents weren't left over from when Porsche worked at Tatra anyway, Porsche may well have thought he had the right to use something that was owned by Tatra because he designed it while he was there. The Ganz book claims that the Tatra patents were illegally obtained during the war anyway and not done to protect anything designed within Tatra, which would certainly explain why it wasn't a problem before the war.

This is just another thread of opinions backed up by no facts, so unless you can come up with some 'proof' then I'm going to lock this thread.

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Fair comment Rob. Unfortunately even Tatra would not be specific to me as to what was actually 'infringed' by Porsche. Perhaps Porsche moved on after a dispute and Tatra had 'an axe to grind with him'. Who will ever know. Not Volksworld or I.:wink:

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It's common practice these days for tech companies to buy patents, either to block rival technologies or to make money from the competition, the Ganz book claims that this is what was going on with Tatra, even claiming that his ideas/drawings where stolen and patented. Prior to VW paying out to Tatra, Heinz Nordhoff requested that Ganz came back to Europe from Australia to help VW dispute the claimed infringements - but unfortunately Ganz was too ill at the time and died shortly after.

I don't suppose we'll ever know the truth...

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Plus, lets not forget the Mercedes attempts at a people's car in the 30s'



and the work of Béla Barényi



In his student days he already thought about the “future people's car”. Sketches he made in 1924-25 prove that he was the intellectual father of the “people’s car” or “Volkswagen”. This would be of particular significance almost twenty years later.

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:smile:  1001894_321557434646768_1204194169_n.jpg You have insufficient rights to see the content.

Tatra's Hans Ledwinka died in near poverty in communist Czechoslovakia. He also spent a five year period in prison at the end of the war, accused of 'collaborating with the Germans'. Whether that was due to any involvement he had with the Volkswagen we'll never know for certain I guess.:unsure:

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Looks a bit like a four door Beetle taxi in the background:?

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