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54 Gertie
14 years ago
Id be lying if I said that I wasnt intrigued but I fear it will be a blurry photo, possibly showing a bit of unground weld. :wink: :twisted:

William
Standard split
14 years ago
Rattletrap was seen basking in the north London sunshine very recently8)

Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
Mike Peckham
14 years ago
I think the DVLA info is quite telling;

Date of Liability 21 12 1994
Date of First Registration 02 03 1961
Year of Manufacture 1950
Cylinder Capacity (cc) 1192CC
CO2 Emissions Not Available
Fuel Type Petrol
Export Marker Not Applicable
Vehicle Status Unlicensed
Vehicle Colour BLACK

It says date of first registration 02/03/1961, and yet Tony claimed that the car was already registered and in regular use in the UK by the late 50s. He used to say that it was part of the opening celebrations for the M1 and was one of the first cars to drive its length - I think the M1 was opened in 1958?

I still think that Tony probably did have a 1950 beetle which he bought in Germany and brought back to the UK, but for what ever reason it had to be replaced, and in 1961 he found himself a nice zwitter on a trip back to Germany and brought it back, registered it as a '50 and continued the mileage log from the original.

Who would have known?

It was probably much later, when people became a bit more savvy and the car gained some notoriety that he developed the story of it being a prototype to explain its zwitter credentials.

All specualtion I know, but in the absence of a more bullet proof explanation there will always be speculation as this thread has proved! :wink:

Out of interest, has there been any other record of these prototypes, other than Rattletrap?

Mike8)

Ps: I still think the whole Rattletrap phenomenon is truly marvellous and Tony must be looking down on us with glee. To think that his car is still provoking debate more than a decade after his death...
July 1957 UK supplied RHD Oval. 1972 World Champion Beetle. 1978 UK supplied RHD 1303LS Cabriolet. 1973 UK supplied RHD 1303s.
54 Gertie
14 years ago

Here's Rattletrap basking in the north London sunshine very recently8)

Standard split wrote:



So you bought it? 😎


Detailed pics then! :wink:
William
GKL 7
14 years ago
Wondered why you were being so defensive John.
Congratulations you spent your hard earned on a "BITSA"
Standard split
14 years ago



It says date of first registration 02/03/1961, and yet Tony claimed that the car was already registered and in regular use in the UK by the late 50s. He used to say that it was part of the opening celebrations for the M1 and was one of the first cars to drive its length - I think the M1 was opened in 1958?

I still think that Tony probably did have a 1950 beetle which he bought in Germany and brought back to the UK, but for what ever reason it had to be replaced, and in 1961 he found himself a nice zwitter on a trip back to Germany and brought it back, registered it as a '50 and continued the mileage log from the original.

Mike Peckham wrote:



Not completely correct.

Tony used to visit with the car before finally having it registered here. Remember he was well know for his journeys abroad with the car.

He may not have been lying with his M1 claim – we should not assume he was[-x

Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
Mike Peckham
14 years ago



He may not have been lying with his M1 claim – we should not assume he was[-x

Standard split wrote:



I didn't say that I thought that he was lying, in fact I don't doubt that claim at all. I doubt however that it was the Rattletrap that was registered in the UK in 1961 that was the one that was there in 1958.

I remain to be convinced by the whole Ratttletrap story, but I could conceivably be if the following two questions are answered;

1/ Why does there not appear to be any evidence of this run of experimental beetles in VW literature when the company were competent enough to record that they had fitted an experimental bearing or tubeless tyres to a run of 800 beetles?

2/ What was it that made VW withdraw their invitation to have the car on show at their museum in Wolfsburg?

I don't think we shall ever know the truth but the detective work is fascinating! :d

Mike
July 1957 UK supplied RHD Oval. 1972 World Champion Beetle. 1978 UK supplied RHD 1303LS Cabriolet. 1973 UK supplied RHD 1303s.
Sunroof53
14 years ago

On this page is Rattltraps original chassis no before it was swapped by TBS.Reg is 10 BXK and no 37 on the list .

https://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f30/sqeeter/register6.jpg 

Sunroof53 wrote:




Click on the link and read the above.I will have to trawl though the articles again to find the 55 chassis reference.Although you can see its a later floor from the resto pics.I am off to work but look forward to your next bombshell.Carefull though ,these things have a habit of blowing up in the wrong direction :wink:

Oh, and that car next to rattletrap needs a polish :twisted:
Standard split
14 years ago
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: OK, ITS BOMBSHELL TIME:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Now I have to admit to doing a double-take when checking this, maybe some will say I'm on a wind-up, and I promise you I'm not.

The body number is 115511 – this makes it a May 1950 car (well body anyway – prototype Zwitter style after all?):shock: :shock:




Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
55Kab
14 years ago

The body number is 115511[/b] – this makes it a 1950 car

Standard split wrote:



As they say, photos or it didn't happen :!:

So do you own it? Fezz up! If so lets see some detailed photos please.

Mike Peckham
14 years ago
Very interesting and certainly thought provoking, but my thoughts are;

1/ The chassis number that Tony quoted as being the "original" relates to a '52 car which is consistant with it being a zwitter.

2/ The jury is still out over what (if any) of the 'original' body remains, so the number on the clip, and we have seen in the photos that the clip was cut away from the 'original' body post crash, remains less compelling than the chassis number offered in the early '70s.

3/ Where is the evidence from VW that there ever was a series of 'experimental' beetles in 1950?

Just my thoughts...

Mike 😎
July 1957 UK supplied RHD Oval. 1972 World Champion Beetle. 1978 UK supplied RHD 1303LS Cabriolet. 1973 UK supplied RHD 1303s.
Rich Oakley
14 years ago
I agree,

John, c'mon, get some detailed pics up. It will be good to see what this car actually is. There was always so much myth and conjecture surrounding this car (as proved by this thread). Don't keep it under wraps, let's see some details and we'll try to figure out between all of us what the score is.

Look forward to the pics.
47 Beetle, 56 UK Karmann Cabriolet, 56 UK Beetle, 57 UK Type 2, 59 UK Beetle, 66 UK Fastback.
Standard split
14 years ago

Very interesting and certainly thought provoking, but my thoughts are;

2/ The jury is still out over what (if any) of the 'original' body remains, so the number on the clip, and we have seen in the photos that the clip was cut away from the 'original' body post crash, remains less compelling than the chassis number offered in the early '70s.

Mike Peckham wrote:



Looking at the car, there is no doubt that this is NOT an Oval window body with a Spilt rear window clip welded in as many argued on this thread. That is a certainty.

Evidence of joins and welds can be traced through the paint, but do not show on camera, some marks are evident when examining the roof. Panels of the left uncrashed side bear much more corrosion than those on the repaired side, especially noticeable on the front quarters. Floor pans are clearly replaced as we know.

From items with the car it is clear that Tony was able to drive this car in the UK on his US Forces plates for a while before being registered 10 BXK. It seems he made visits here prior to 1960. It is certainly looking as though this was the original car he had, but as some may say its like the original broom that still exists, but with a replacement head and handle.

Essentially, there is at least some of the original car left, as well as Tony's spirit which still seems to be with it – probably lapping up all the attention.

Not the most collectable early 'Beetle' in originality and condition terms, but the legend that goes with the thing makes it irreplaceable and the jewel in the crown of any VW collection 😎

One thing that makes the DeLuxe Zwitter the best looking 'Beetle' viewed from the back is the Split-window with the aluminum trim around it. In the half light the window sure stands out, but needs to be black though :wink:

Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
Standard split
14 years ago

Wondered why you were being so defensive John.
Congratulations you spent your hard earned on a "BITSA"

'50 Karmann wrote:



A BITSA for sure, but it even challenges my '49 for the limelight – priceless8) 😎 😎 😎 😎 😎 😎
Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
JD
  • JD
  • pre67vw Junkie
14 years ago
Aside from everything else John, I´m really happy that you have the car of your dreams from when you were young(er?). Not many people get to achieve that!:beer:
"John, you need to get a grip and STOP MOANING AT EVERYTHING. ThumbDown "
UserPostedImage
Mike Peckham
14 years ago

Aside from everything else John, I´m really happy that you have the car of your dreams from when you were young(er?). Not many people get to achieve that!:beer:

JD wrote:



x 2
July 1957 UK supplied RHD Oval. 1972 World Champion Beetle. 1978 UK supplied RHD 1303LS Cabriolet. 1973 UK supplied RHD 1303s.
Standard split
14 years ago

Aside from everything else John, I´m really happy that you have the car of your dreams from when you were young(er?). Not many people get to achieve that!:beer:

JD wrote:



Thanks, and Mike too.

You remembered my earlier post then: [quote=Standard split]

Rattletrap was the first split I ever saw. Back in 1977, and the Queen's Silver Jubilee, while we were waiting for the Queen's open carriage to pass, Rattletrap managed to run across the road junction just before it was closed. It was more of a treat for the young John than seeing the Queen pass afterwards. That sowed the seed for me to own a Split-Window Beetle when I was able to drive. More fascinating Rattletrap history 8)

[/quote

Can't spell out the excitement at seeing the thing back then, I easily remembered the unusual and short registration 😎

Had to have a split after that – the stuff dreams were made of for me back then:wink:

Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
54 Gertie
14 years ago
Well done, I really hoped this thread would have a happy ending. 😎

C'mon then, get some pics up! Seeing as you can clearly use the attatch function. :wink:


Also, I trust you will be giving the old girl a pounding round the streets of London? :wink: :d 😎 :beer:

Enjoy
William
Standard split
14 years ago

Well done, I really hoped this thread would have a happy ending. 😎

C'mon then, get some pics up! Seeing as you can clearly use the attatch function. :wink:


Also, I trust you will be giving the old girl a pounding round the streets of London? :wink: :d 😎 :beer:

Enjoy

54 Gertie wrote:



Have to get the camera out, I think Rattletrap loves attention, I know that Tony would love it – although its not so much my thing, my cars generally stay under wraps.
Rattletrap's a little different though, sort of everyone's car in a way:p

According to documents, Rattletrap must know London's streets better than me, spent most its life there, and still there now :wink:

Rattletrap – the Volkswagen Beetle that has covered an incredible mileage equivalent to over 35 times around the planet :omg:
Running nifty since 1950… the King of Volkswagens:beer: Why not make friends with this famous little VW – he's on facebook! :d
http://forums.pre67vw.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16378 
pre67vw
14 years ago



When was the last time you saw Rattletrap John?

pre67vw wrote:



Glad you finally owned up, it was the best way this thread could go...

Congrats on owning a piece of VW folklore :beer:
Rob Amos
Happiness is a stock VW
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