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Posted by: 48REME - 25 June 2007 15:56:07
Just returned from the 1300km round trip to Bad Camberg with, luckily, absolutely no mechanical setbacks and thought I would share my feelings of disapointment with the weekend. This is the third one I attended and I didn't feel it had the buzz of the previous ones. I don't actually think I'll bother if there still is one in 2011... I thought it was great to meet everyone again, like-minded enthusiasts from all over and finally put faces to names from the forum. This made up for the unfortunate weather conditions we had overall. I think we need to thank ourselves for making the effort to come and not the organisers of what I thought was a missed opportunity. Considering this event only occurs every four years and that participants had to fork out 60 euros just to be allowed in with their cars, I thought there was no effort in preparing any sort of special display or event. Cars were all over the place and in no particular arrangement. I was shocked for example that the family Schulz's silver Hebmuller was left on a parking slot in front of a shop simply because they had not registered; Is this the spirit of the event? I'd rather see that car on the field than the many modified buses which increasingly take over what is supposed to be a meeting for original vintage VWs. Also, amenities and facilities were appaling, not exactly an inviting welcome to people who travelled from far. I just think that since 250 participants to the field paid 60 euros each (just do the maths!), a bit more care could have been taken to make the people and their cars feel a bit more special! I have heard from many people that Hessisch Oldendorf was a far better event two years ago. I went in 2001 and certainly enjoyed it far more than this weekend's event. On the other hand, I still can't get over the fantastic hospitality, generosity and care shown by Bob and the BBT crew, in both organising the party and the cruise down to Bad Camberg. This was truly a special treat from a genuine enthusiast who really cares. I can honestly say that this journey wouldn't have been worth it for me if it hadn't been for the BBT experience. I spoke to a lot of people who had exactly the same impression of this weekend and I really don't mind voicing my opinion even if some don't agree. I think someone needs to or the standards will just keep dropping... :(

Posted by: 48REME - 25 June 2007 15:56:07

Just returned from the 1300km round trip to Bad Camberg with, luckily, absolutely no mechanical setbacks and thought I would share my feelings of disapointment with the weekend. This is the third one I attended and I didn't feel it had the buzz of the previous ones. I don't actually think I'll bother if there still is one in 2011... I thought it was great to meet everyone again, like-minded enthusiasts from all over and finally put faces to names from the forum. This made up for the unfortunate weather conditions we had overall. I think we need to thank ourselves for making the effort to come and not the organisers of what I thought was a missed opportunity. Considering this event only occurs every four years and that participants had to fork out 60 euros just to be allowed in with their cars, I thought there was no effort in preparing any sort of special display or event. Cars were all over the place and in no particular arrangement. I was shocked for example that the family Schulz's silver Hebmuller was left on a parking slot in front of a shop simply because they had not registered; Is this the spirit of the event? I'd rather see that car on the field than the many modified buses which increasingly take over what is supposed to be a meeting for original vintage VWs. Also, amenities and facilities were appaling, not exactly an inviting welcome to people who travelled from far. I just think that since 250 participants to the field paid 60 euros each (just do the maths!), a bit more care could have been taken to make the people and their cars feel a bit more special! I have heard from many people that Hessisch Oldendorf was a far better event two years ago. I went in 2001 and certainly enjoyed it far more than this weekend's event. On the other hand, I still can't get over the fantastic hospitality, generosity and care shown by Bob and the BBT crew, in both organising the party and the cruise down to Bad Camberg. This was truly a special treat from a genuine enthusiast who really cares. I can honestly say that this journey wouldn't have been worth it for me if it hadn't been for the BBT experience. I spoke to a lot of people who had exactly the same impression of this weekend and I really don't mind voicing my opinion even if some don't agree. I think someone needs to or the standards will just keep dropping... :(

Posted by: 2splits - 25 June 2007 16:31:06
Interesting post. Having never been to Camberg or HO, I really don't have room to talk. But last year I made a choice, Camberg this year, or HO in 2. Well, as you can see, i decided to wait, and I'm glad I did. I hope HO is better organized than what you described about camberg, and I hope that it is truly is a vintage event - leave the lowered cars at home. Thanks for sharing your opinion. Looking at the pictures I have seen, I kind of had the same impression. Anybody know the specifics yet on HO?

Posted by: 2splits - 25 June 2007 16:31:06

Interesting post. Having never been to Camberg or HO, I really don't have room to talk. But last year I made a choice, Camberg this year, or HO in 2. Well, as you can see, i decided to wait, and I'm glad I did. I hope HO is better organized than what you described about camberg, and I hope that it is truly is a vintage event - leave the lowered cars at home. Thanks for sharing your opinion. Looking at the pictures I have seen, I kind of had the same impression. Anybody know the specifics yet on HO?

Posted by: JD - 25 June 2007 17:21:07
I had a great time, but I didn't pay to enter. Wasn't keen on seeing all the pikey looking busses on the field either, but my pal who came with me was loving them, so what can I say? Each to there own. Shame the weather wasn't a little better though. JD

Posted by: 48REME - 25 June 2007 19:38:27
Oh I had a great time too, don't get me wrong, thanks to the people there. I just think it should have been much better as a show.

Posted by: vintagevw - 25 June 2007 22:01:37
I agree with 48REME, was there actually an organisation? I had also a friend who couldn't entry with his Heb.....,shame shame shame and what about the older people who don't even have internet, the list was full 9 months before the event... think about it. I enjoyed de show very much and met a lot of friends again but HO is much better. Can't wait for Lavenham....

Posted by: pre67vw - 25 June 2007 22:46:01
Got home at 3am this morning, no major problems in Kev's Karmann - seemed to motor along very nicely (although a little damp in places :lol: ). Richard lost his windscreen in his fastback a few miles after getting off the ferry, he got in at 4am and had to go to work today, he must have been knackered! I agree that the organisation could have been better, 60Euros for a plaque, 2 mugs and a parking space in a muddy field doesn't scream value for money, but I seriously doubt there was much profit at the end of the event. I heard quite a few people say that now the VW dealer is no longer lottermans, the show has lost its reason for being there. It was great to catch up with the people you only get to see at the international shows and there were still plenty of nice cars there. It could have been better though, not many pre-49 Beetles, one Rometsch Banana (very nice), no Paplers, no Police Hebs. Too many knackered/lowered barn doors for my liking and sadly they were mostly all English.

Posted by: pre67vw - 25 June 2007 22:46:01

Got home at 3am this morning, no major problems in Kev's Karmann - seemed to motor along very nicely (although a little damp in places :lol: ). Richard lost his windscreen in his fastback a few miles after getting off the ferry, he got in at 4am and had to go to work today, he must have been knackered! I agree that the organisation could have been better, 60Euros for a plaque, 2 mugs and a parking space in a muddy field doesn't scream value for money, but I seriously doubt there was much profit at the end of the event. I heard quite a few people say that now the VW dealer is no longer lottermans, the show has lost its reason for being there. It was great to catch up with the people you only get to see at the international shows and there were still plenty of nice cars there. It could have been better though, not many pre-49 Beetles, one Rometsch Banana (very nice), no Paplers, no Police Hebs. Too many knackered/lowered barn doors for my liking and sadly they were mostly all English.

Posted by: JD - 25 June 2007 23:23:37
[quote="pre67vw"]Too many knackered/lowered barn doors for my liking and sadly they were mostly all English. [/quote] Yes - they should re-name that club the British Split Bus Banger Racers Association or something. :oops: "Do ye wanna buy a daag?/tarmac ye drive mister?/buy some lucky heather, etc, etc..."

Posted by: pre67vw - 25 June 2007 23:27:26
[quote="JD"][quote="pre67vw"]Too many knackered/lowered barn doors for my liking and sadly they were mostly all English. [/quote] Yes - they should re-name that club the British Split Bus Banger Racers Association or something. :oops: "Do ye wanna buy a daag?/tarmac ye drive mister?/buy some lucky heather, etc, etc..." [/quote] :lol: :lol: I heard your car was there but I missed it, would have liked to have met you and had a look around it.

Posted by: pre67vw - 25 June 2007 23:27:26

[quote="JD"][quote="pre67vw"]Too many knackered/lowered barn doors for my liking and sadly they were mostly all English. [/quote] Yes - they should re-name that club the British Split Bus Banger Racers Association or something. :oops: "Do ye wanna buy a daag?/tarmac ye drive mister?/buy some lucky heather, etc, etc..." [/quote] :lol: :lol: I heard your car was there but I missed it, would have liked to have met you and had a look around it.

Posted by: Rich Oakley - 26 June 2007 10:22:32
I had a great time over there, but I must admit that it didn't live up to my expectations in terms of the quantity of 'special' vehicles on display. Not enough pre-'49 stuff for my liking and not as many coachbuilts as I had expected. Maybe the enthusiasm for organising the event has diminished a little since the passing of Willi Lotterman and the loss of their dealership. Roll on Hessisch....

Posted by: Rich Oakley - 26 June 2007 10:24:26
[quote="pre67vw"] Richard lost his windscreen in his fastback a few miles after getting off the ferry, he got in at 4am and had to go to work today, he must have been knackered! [/quote] I had less than two hours sleep before my daughter woke me up. Still knackered now! :lol: [img]https://home.btconnect.com/oakley/DSC09933.JPG[/img]

Posted by: 48REME - 26 June 2007 12:22:19
[quote="vintagevw"] the list was full 9 months before the event... think about it. Really? I wonder why there was still loads of space at the back of the field. I heard any old car could register later on Saturday because they actually had space left. I went to the Lotterman girls in the marquee and asked to get in at 6:30pm on Saturday (more than half of the show already gone anyway) and STILL was told I would have to pay 60 euros! What a farce!

Posted by: 48REME - 26 June 2007 12:22:19

[quote="vintagevw"] the list was full 9 months before the event... think about it. Really? I wonder why there was still loads of space at the back of the field. I heard any old car could register later on Saturday because they actually had space left. I went to the Lotterman girls in the marquee and asked to get in at 6:30pm on Saturday (more than half of the show already gone anyway) and STILL was told I would have to pay 60 euros! What a farce!

Posted by: 48REME - 26 June 2007 12:24:59
I seriously doubt there was much profit at the end of the event.[quote] Well I wonder where the 15000 euros went then, considering that there was a huge list of sponsors who most definitely helped to finance the so-called facilities![/quote]

Posted by: 48REME - 26 June 2007 12:26:47
Richard, I am so sorry to hear about your ordeal! What a bummer... I will email you about 'cherry red'... :wink:

Posted by: vintagevw - 26 June 2007 12:38:20
Who could take a shower next to the event..... Oh, there was no... And only e few toilets for the thousands people! Could be better!

Posted by: RockStock - 26 June 2007 14:54:40
i agree a lot with 48REME yes, HO, so much better organised..the whole town gets involved HO is REALLY well organised at HO, cars are arranged in line-ups - how hard can that be to do at BC? a row of split cabs, then oval cabs, then splits pre49/49-53, ovals, Hebs, Coachbuilts....etc FAR too many custom cars at BC...its a stock show, KEEP IT STOCK!! if you prefer custom, this shouldnt be the show for you! the brit 'roll-in' on the sunday, with all the slammed rides, felt wrong. yeah, like a fart at a funeral lowered cars can come in, but they need to be RARE. Not a lowered t3! it was great to see all the BDs there, even though too many (imo) were slammed cant believe they charge for the vehicles on display!! THATS MADNESS!!!!!! You Lavenham Guys - you have a great opportunity to put on a great event just get the basics right. stringent entry rules, good organisation, clear communication on whats going on (how many people knew about the road trip at BC? i didnt), structure, provide every incentive for the rare cars to attend at BC i saw the silver Heb up the road too. unbelievable it wasnt readily allowed in? i assumed it could have been fake (for it not to have been on the show ground) the field is too small, too enclosed. time for a rethink i heard a lot of german cars didnt show because of the weather Bob/BBT - looks like top generosity to me dont get me wrong, i loved the show, had a top time, and THANK YOU SO MUCH to the guys that put the show on. would hate it to not continue

Posted by: RockStock - 26 June 2007 14:54:40

i agree a lot with 48REME yes, HO, so much better organised..the whole town gets involved HO is REALLY well organised at HO, cars are arranged in line-ups - how hard can that be to do at BC? a row of split cabs, then oval cabs, then splits pre49/49-53, ovals, Hebs, Coachbuilts....etc FAR too many custom cars at BC...its a stock show, KEEP IT STOCK!! if you prefer custom, this shouldnt be the show for you! the brit 'roll-in' on the sunday, with all the slammed rides, felt wrong. yeah, like a fart at a funeral lowered cars can come in, but they need to be RARE. Not a lowered t3! it was great to see all the BDs there, even though too many (imo) were slammed cant believe they charge for the vehicles on display!! THATS MADNESS!!!!!! You Lavenham Guys - you have a great opportunity to put on a great event just get the basics right. stringent entry rules, good organisation, clear communication on whats going on (how many people knew about the road trip at BC? i didnt), structure, provide every incentive for the rare cars to attend at BC i saw the silver Heb up the road too. unbelievable it wasnt readily allowed in? i assumed it could have been fake (for it not to have been on the show ground) the field is too small, too enclosed. time for a rethink i heard a lot of german cars didnt show because of the weather Bob/BBT - looks like top generosity to me dont get me wrong, i loved the show, had a top time, and THANK YOU SO MUCH to the guys that put the show on. would hate it to not continue

Posted by: mrsherbie - 26 June 2007 16:36:27
It was a good trip. Once again BBT Bob opened his doors to hundreds of complete strangers. Fed us and amazed us with his fuelled passion for all shapes of vw's. I dont play vw politics and I do personally also feel the Heb should have been saved for Bug In. I understand having fun with a car, my car is the same in principle but I know more stock people were offended than appreciated the sight of it at this particular event in its current clothes. We still do truly love you Bob x :wink: and cannot thank you enough for the energy and inspiration you spread amongst us all, but I think in this instance you over estimated other people's ability to see and understand the bigger picture of your actions. Sadly I agree with 48REME's comments here and also Gary from Brezelwerks 100% on the samba also. But I dont blame the Lotterman team one bit! their relaxed show style approach is absolutely wonderful! But unfortunately these days the show has become a victim of its own success. Even more sadly us Brits are the worst criminals in this show destruction mayhem. Thats whats so horrible about this. There is no turning back the clock that will work here. ________________ I quote Rockstock from the samba: "KEEP BC STOCK! choose photo vetting reserve the right to refuse field entry on the day if modified, entry at the discretion of the organisers, directly related to rarity. & keep that bar high (ie Bob's Heb gets in, RJs 23w gets in - bar sits just below these) the BC display field is small. when i go to BC, i want to see stock VWs. the modified look out of place. i'm hoping the organisers have this in hand - it's important did you look at the cal look line-up at HO? i didn't imo, a rare car that gets lowered/modified loses a lot of its innocence. for some reason, this innocence doesnt all come back when the car is returned to stock" _______________ The reason ourselves and others drove across 4 countries to this show is because it is one of only a few stock vintage vw shows left for us. As I said months ago, the selfish organisation of the Bug-In to ride directly on the back of Camberg has destroyed the show. I doubt we will ever go to Bad Camberg again. Everyone else in our party feels the same way. Again we thank the Lotterman family and will never forget the good times. I feel only disappointment, sadness and anger today: [url=https://www.ssvc.ukshells.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=31967]ssvc thread about thefts at Camberg[/url]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 26 June 2007 16:36:27

It was a good trip. Once again BBT Bob opened his doors to hundreds of complete strangers. Fed us and amazed us with his fuelled passion for all shapes of vw's. I dont play vw politics and I do personally also feel the Heb should have been saved for Bug In. I understand having fun with a car, my car is the same in principle but I know more stock people were offended than appreciated the sight of it at this particular event in its current clothes. We still do truly love you Bob x :wink: and cannot thank you enough for the energy and inspiration you spread amongst us all, but I think in this instance you over estimated other people's ability to see and understand the bigger picture of your actions. Sadly I agree with 48REME's comments here and also Gary from Brezelwerks 100% on the samba also. But I dont blame the Lotterman team one bit! their relaxed show style approach is absolutely wonderful! But unfortunately these days the show has become a victim of its own success. Even more sadly us Brits are the worst criminals in this show destruction mayhem. Thats whats so horrible about this. There is no turning back the clock that will work here. ________________ I quote Rockstock from the samba: "KEEP BC STOCK! choose photo vetting reserve the right to refuse field entry on the day if modified, entry at the discretion of the organisers, directly related to rarity. & keep that bar high (ie Bob's Heb gets in, RJs 23w gets in - bar sits just below these) the BC display field is small. when i go to BC, i want to see stock VWs. the modified look out of place. i'm hoping the organisers have this in hand - it's important did you look at the cal look line-up at HO? i didn't imo, a rare car that gets lowered/modified loses a lot of its innocence. for some reason, this innocence doesnt all come back when the car is returned to stock" _______________ The reason ourselves and others drove across 4 countries to this show is because it is one of only a few stock vintage vw shows left for us. As I said months ago, the selfish organisation of the Bug-In to ride directly on the back of Camberg has destroyed the show. I doubt we will ever go to Bad Camberg again. Everyone else in our party feels the same way. Again we thank the Lotterman family and will never forget the good times. I feel only disappointment, sadness and anger today: [url=https://www.ssvc.ukshells.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=31967]ssvc thread about thefts at Camberg[/url]

Posted by: 356boy - 26 June 2007 17:04:56
totally agree with everything above, those pair of dickheads in that bus also damaged a blue passat in the parking area and then cleared off leaving a st georges chair and all the beer cans, gives the rest of us british a bad name. ok have some fun but not at others expense. [ATTACH]1616[/Attach]

Posted by: 48REME - 26 June 2007 18:26:14
Were they part of the group in which a bearded bald headed guy so elegantly threw up at the BBT party among the tables and chairs where we were having drinks? I thought that was something!!! :evil:

Posted by: lou cypher - 26 June 2007 20:11:57
Hey guy's this is so true, these are the idiots that get you Brits a bad name and are the sort of people that need to be kept out of the Vintage shows. I know that you shouldn't "tar everyone with the same brush" but it does happen, I was around to see the disgraceful behaviour in the parking lot by these guys. When they left their rubbish behind a group of Germans passed, looking at the chair & empty cans, commenting that it was typical of Brits! These are the sort of people we need to discourage from attending HO, I am a veteran now of 4 BC's and I too don't think that it will happen again, due to these mindless idiots and the fact that Willy is no longer the driving force behind it. I have been to HO since the begining when it was just a small show with not many cars and nothing like it was 2 years ago. This is now the premier show for us hardcore VW fans in Europe. I don't wish to see this behaviour there, maybe Christian should reserve the right to refuse admin, it would be such a shame for a small number to ruin it for the faithfull. :evil: There was actually an occasion on the saturday night when I nearlly had to show my tridend to one of the "swap things", for the abusive drunken loudmouthing.But life is too short and he who laughs last, laughs the loudest. :twisted: Does he not know better than to mess with Lou Cypher, maybe I should spell it a little better that they can read Loo-ci-fer :twisted:

Posted by: lou cypher - 26 June 2007 20:11:57

Hey guy's this is so true, these are the idiots that get you Brits a bad name and are the sort of people that need to be kept out of the Vintage shows. I know that you shouldn't "tar everyone with the same brush" but it does happen, I was around to see the disgraceful behaviour in the parking lot by these guys. When they left their rubbish behind a group of Germans passed, looking at the chair & empty cans, commenting that it was typical of Brits! These are the sort of people we need to discourage from attending HO, I am a veteran now of 4 BC's and I too don't think that it will happen again, due to these mindless idiots and the fact that Willy is no longer the driving force behind it. I have been to HO since the begining when it was just a small show with not many cars and nothing like it was 2 years ago. This is now the premier show for us hardcore VW fans in Europe. I don't wish to see this behaviour there, maybe Christian should reserve the right to refuse admin, it would be such a shame for a small number to ruin it for the faithfull. :evil: There was actually an occasion on the saturday night when I nearlly had to show my tridend to one of the "swap things", for the abusive drunken loudmouthing.But life is too short and he who laughs last, laughs the loudest. :twisted: Does he not know better than to mess with Lou Cypher, maybe I should spell it a little better that they can read Loo-ci-fer :twisted:

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 27 June 2007 12:44:47
THE KING IS DEAD,LONG LIVE THE KING. [ATTACH]1611[/Attach]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 13:20:00
A green bay window camper late 70's all Taiga green I think with white westie roof turned up around 2am and started to play VERY loud music right outside the tent on the field. They were not British. They must have woken people up and maybe the rest of the locals?! We walked back to our guesthouse with Mr Bond around 2am and I am so relieved that his Rometsch left on the field was untouched. I hate to post negative things about shows :( I think some of the problem is the entry system. We decided not to bring both our registered cars at the very last moment, but gave up the space to another stock 50 beetle that had only just been finished full restoration in time but had no booking. But I know many other people turned up in different vw's to those they had registered. They collected their registration bags ( very nice by the way :wink: ) and then stuck their window sticker pass on their vws. At this point when they tried to gain entry onto the field in a Bay window/beige 60's westie/that yellow splitbus!!? :roll: They SHOULD have been turned away from parking on the show field! 356boy could have done this also in his 53 Porsche which was parked on the street, and he has also many wonderful other early vws, but he didnt. The other 2 356's also in our group stayed parked up in the guesthouse all weekend and not taken anywhere near the field the whole time. A place should have been found for that silver Heb somehow! Dont get me wrong, I understand space was limited and I am not being a snob about these vehicles BUT just about everyone who attended the show in cars and on foot owns other types of old vws, I know most of us who use the pre53 forum here also have post57 beetles ( and also post67 vw's) and we love them just as much as the old ones, BUT these shows are NOT for these 'other' cars. And we all know this. My target was to finish my car for Camberg and now it is done I will take it only to War & Peace show and then Peppercorn this year. At H.O. the organisation was amazing. But even then there was someone who broke the rules by entering a '67 bus' which turned out to be a 68 Bay! :roll: I dont care about model change exact dates, pre67 meant SPLIT not Bay! And they knew it. Why does it always seem to be fellow Brits who try to get around the rules for their own selfish use? :roll: I think both the Lotterman and Grundmann teams are so honest and relaxed but it will be British who will bend the rules. It is so unfair on everyone and NOT in the spirit of these events. I think the last H.O. was an indicator. If it stays 'pre67 buses' ( any type) I think it will be in danger from being over-run by uk buses as has happened to ALL of our uk shows now. Dont get me wrong we have pre67 buses of our own and love them, but I think most European show promotors under-estimate just how many there are on uk roads now. The pre55 bus rule is a very good one. But given the extra space in H.O. maybe pre-60 buses? (semaphore buses) and extra special bodies pre67 only, ie. laddertruck, wide bed pickups etc only with pre-approval by photo. But, in defence of the modified British barndoors, it seems to be this very stong uk scene which is saving these buses, many of which the rest of the world do not want because they are so rusty. Paul Wisk's restoration of his barndoor samba (which was on the field) will save many more dead rusty barndoors because he has shown that it CAN be done. [img]https://www.barndoor.dk/20-081713/images/20-081713_7.jpg[/img] :shock: :D I think you will have a lot of fun at Bug In TeufelHeb. Next time we see it, whatever guise the body appears in, we will expect its underside to be as shiny as George Lloyds Kab! :wink: :shock: :D [/i]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 13:20:00

A green bay window camper late 70's all Taiga green I think with white westie roof turned up around 2am and started to play VERY loud music right outside the tent on the field. They were not British. They must have woken people up and maybe the rest of the locals?! We walked back to our guesthouse with Mr Bond around 2am and I am so relieved that his Rometsch left on the field was untouched. I hate to post negative things about shows :( I think some of the problem is the entry system. We decided not to bring both our registered cars at the very last moment, but gave up the space to another stock 50 beetle that had only just been finished full restoration in time but had no booking. But I know many other people turned up in different vw's to those they had registered. They collected their registration bags ( very nice by the way :wink: ) and then stuck their window sticker pass on their vws. At this point when they tried to gain entry onto the field in a Bay window/beige 60's westie/that yellow splitbus!!? :roll: They SHOULD have been turned away from parking on the show field! 356boy could have done this also in his 53 Porsche which was parked on the street, and he has also many wonderful other early vws, but he didnt. The other 2 356's also in our group stayed parked up in the guesthouse all weekend and not taken anywhere near the field the whole time. A place should have been found for that silver Heb somehow! Dont get me wrong, I understand space was limited and I am not being a snob about these vehicles BUT just about everyone who attended the show in cars and on foot owns other types of old vws, I know most of us who use the pre53 forum here also have post57 beetles ( and also post67 vw's) and we love them just as much as the old ones, BUT these shows are NOT for these 'other' cars. And we all know this. My target was to finish my car for Camberg and now it is done I will take it only to War & Peace show and then Peppercorn this year. At H.O. the organisation was amazing. But even then there was someone who broke the rules by entering a '67 bus' which turned out to be a 68 Bay! :roll: I dont care about model change exact dates, pre67 meant SPLIT not Bay! And they knew it. Why does it always seem to be fellow Brits who try to get around the rules for their own selfish use? :roll: I think both the Lotterman and Grundmann teams are so honest and relaxed but it will be British who will bend the rules. It is so unfair on everyone and NOT in the spirit of these events. I think the last H.O. was an indicator. If it stays 'pre67 buses' ( any type) I think it will be in danger from being over-run by uk buses as has happened to ALL of our uk shows now. Dont get me wrong we have pre67 buses of our own and love them, but I think most European show promotors under-estimate just how many there are on uk roads now. The pre55 bus rule is a very good one. But given the extra space in H.O. maybe pre-60 buses? (semaphore buses) and extra special bodies pre67 only, ie. laddertruck, wide bed pickups etc only with pre-approval by photo. But, in defence of the modified British barndoors, it seems to be this very stong uk scene which is saving these buses, many of which the rest of the world do not want because they are so rusty. Paul Wisk's restoration of his barndoor samba (which was on the field) will save many more dead rusty barndoors because he has shown that it CAN be done. [img]https://www.barndoor.dk/20-081713/images/20-081713_7.jpg[/img] :shock: :D I think you will have a lot of fun at Bug In TeufelHeb. Next time we see it, whatever guise the body appears in, we will expect its underside to be as shiny as George Lloyds Kab! :wink: :shock: :D [/i]

Posted by: 48REME - 27 June 2007 14:44:29
To quote mrsherbie: 'I know most of us who use this pre53 forum also have post57 beetles and we love them just as much as the old ones, BUT these shows are NOT for these 'other' cars.' Firstly, this is not just a pre-53 forum. I also think there is a certain snobbery with the August 57 cut-off point. To my surprise, I actually had some hardcore enthusiast wondering why my square-window Standard Sunroof wasn't elegible when it was actually the only car of its kind in town as well as being one of only four around. With all due respect (and I do love them) there is a plethora of Ovals and Splits and I wonder if the slightly blinkered age restriction isn't outruling a diversity and rarity which doesn't stop in 1957, far from it. I think an original car with semaphores has just as much right (if not more!), to be there as some early 50s bus or Split beetle which has been lowered and fitted with big wheels, etc...! :shock:

Posted by: 48REME - 27 June 2007 14:44:29

To quote mrsherbie: 'I know most of us who use this pre53 forum also have post57 beetles and we love them just as much as the old ones, BUT these shows are NOT for these 'other' cars.' Firstly, this is not just a pre-53 forum. I also think there is a certain snobbery with the August 57 cut-off point. To my surprise, I actually had some hardcore enthusiast wondering why my square-window Standard Sunroof wasn't elegible when it was actually the only car of its kind in town as well as being one of only four around. With all due respect (and I do love them) there is a plethora of Ovals and Splits and I wonder if the slightly blinkered age restriction isn't outruling a diversity and rarity which doesn't stop in 1957, far from it. I think an original car with semaphores has just as much right (if not more!), to be there as some early 50s bus or Split beetle which has been lowered and fitted with big wheels, etc...! :shock:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 15:11:42
[quote="48REME"]To my surprise, I actually had some hardcore enthusiast wondering why my square-window Standard Sunroof wasn't elegible when it was actually the only car of its kind in town as well as being one of only four around.[/quote] I agree with you totally and we commented on this as well each time we drove past your car. Standard's are very rare but unfortunately fall into a loophole of obscurity because as we know people dont know/understand enough about them. Regarding pre57. There have to be some rules when there is limited space available. If you make the rules too complex it will become a very confusing registration system. Why dont you email The H.O. team to see if they would consider a special display of standard only beetles :?: In a year by year lineup :?: You are THE MAN :D with the MOST knowledge to pull a European group of these cars together, and I for one, would absolutely LOVE to see a lineup of these! I dont think this has ever been done before? To quote Rockstock as before : "did you look at the cal look line-up at HO? i didn't" No, me neither. They were beautiful cars but there are Cal-look cars everywhere these days. They are not special enough to me. [url=https://www.flat4ever.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=18036]48Reme standard[/url]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 15:11:42

[quote="48REME"]To my surprise, I actually had some hardcore enthusiast wondering why my square-window Standard Sunroof wasn't elegible when it was actually the only car of its kind in town as well as being one of only four around.[/quote] I agree with you totally and we commented on this as well each time we drove past your car. Standard's are very rare but unfortunately fall into a loophole of obscurity because as we know people dont know/understand enough about them. Regarding pre57. There have to be some rules when there is limited space available. If you make the rules too complex it will become a very confusing registration system. Why dont you email The H.O. team to see if they would consider a special display of standard only beetles :?: In a year by year lineup :?: You are THE MAN :D with the MOST knowledge to pull a European group of these cars together, and I for one, would absolutely LOVE to see a lineup of these! I dont think this has ever been done before? To quote Rockstock as before : "did you look at the cal look line-up at HO? i didn't" No, me neither. They were beautiful cars but there are Cal-look cars everywhere these days. They are not special enough to me. [url=https://www.flat4ever.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=18036]48Reme standard[/url]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 15:28:25
[quote="48REME"][quote="mrsherbie"] 'I know most of us who use this pre53 forum[/quote] Firstly, this is not just a pre-53 forum. [/quote] Sorry Nicholas, that was a mistake, confused error in typing. I get a little dizzy like that sometimes :lol: I have changed it now :D ps. we have a late '79 :lol: :D Hang on, I'm off to start a new post 78 forum and show.... no pre78 cars allowed :D

Posted by: JD - 27 June 2007 15:44:55
[quote="mrsherbie"] Paul Wisk's restoration of his barndoor samba (which was on the field) will save many more dead rusty barndoors because he has shown that it CAN be done. [img]https://www.barndoor.dk/20-081713/images/20-081713_7.jpg[/img] :shock: :D [/i][/quote] I had also seen "before" pics of this, so i knew the story and I had some appreciation of the van - BUT - why didn't he paint it or at least polish it a bit, to stop it looking like just another knackered old bus? Some people still don't seem to appreciate the difference between patina, which comes from use - and plain old fashioned decay.

Posted by: JD - 27 June 2007 15:44:55

[quote="mrsherbie"] Paul Wisk's restoration of his barndoor samba (which was on the field) will save many more dead rusty barndoors because he has shown that it CAN be done. [img]https://www.barndoor.dk/20-081713/images/20-081713_7.jpg[/img] :shock: :D [/i][/quote] I had also seen "before" pics of this, so i knew the story and I had some appreciation of the van - BUT - why didn't he paint it or at least polish it a bit, to stop it looking like just another knackered old bus? Some people still don't seem to appreciate the difference between patina, which comes from use - and plain old fashioned decay.

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 15:55:03
[quote="JD"] BUT - why didn't he paint it or at least polish it a bit, to stop it looking like just another knackered old bus? [/quote] We will have to agree to disagree. There are more restored barndoor sambas on the road than original paint ones. What he has done is far more clever than just using a pile of new repro metal body panels and filler and paint to hide the shell's imperfections. My point using this bus was only that after reviving this bus from the grave ( not something most of us could have even managed given what he started with!) As far as I am concerned he can do whatever he wants with it! On the flipside some people buy, and then screw up really good and rare buses, take the Arcomobil: [url=https://www.ssvc.ukshells.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=29609&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=arcomobile&start=0&sid=1d7e8bf364cb46f7e76eab5ac87b916d]ssvc Camper [/url]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 15:55:03

[quote="JD"] BUT - why didn't he paint it or at least polish it a bit, to stop it looking like just another knackered old bus? [/quote] We will have to agree to disagree. There are more restored barndoor sambas on the road than original paint ones. What he has done is far more clever than just using a pile of new repro metal body panels and filler and paint to hide the shell's imperfections. My point using this bus was only that after reviving this bus from the grave ( not something most of us could have even managed given what he started with!) As far as I am concerned he can do whatever he wants with it! On the flipside some people buy, and then screw up really good and rare buses, take the Arcomobil: [url=https://www.ssvc.ukshells.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=29609&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=arcomobile&start=0&sid=1d7e8bf364cb46f7e76eab5ac87b916d]ssvc Camper [/url]

Posted by: JD - 27 June 2007 16:08:42
Yes, of course he can do what he wants with it, but for the want of a drop of T cut, it could have looked a lot better (In my worthless opinion). I mean, he's gone to one hell of a lot of trouble to restore it, but then decided to make an exception in the case of the paint. Why? Oh well, it don't matter to me. I hate busses anyway. :D

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 16:23:12
If you have a fair amount of surface rust in the paint, T cut will leave white marks. Its only good for the good solid paint areas, so you end up with shiny in patches. Thats why Ankor wax is so good, just gives it a greasy film across the whole surface to help waterproof (like a ducks feathers) and brings up the colour a bit like on our old surface rusty brown girl :wink: But then it becomes impossible to paint anyway. So many confusing "to resto or not to resto" choices :? :D

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 16:23:12

If you have a fair amount of surface rust in the paint, T cut will leave white marks. Its only good for the good solid paint areas, so you end up with shiny in patches. Thats why Ankor wax is so good, just gives it a greasy film across the whole surface to help waterproof (like a ducks feathers) and brings up the colour a bit like on our old surface rusty brown girl :wink: But then it becomes impossible to paint anyway. So many confusing "to resto or not to resto" choices :? :D

Posted by: mrsherbie - 27 June 2007 16:29:33
He painted the underside :D [img]https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v213/Scotty58/Paul%20Wisk%20Samba/PICT0088.jpg[/img] Anyway, now you are sending me off track talking about buses...! :lol: ps. I know you secretly loved snowy the snowmobile JD you big softy X

Posted by: JD - 27 June 2007 16:31:52
Snowy the who? :D Did you get the pic I sent ? Dead soppy me.

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 27 June 2007 17:30:07
[quote="JD"] but for the want of a drop of T cut, :D [/quote] Please do not use that stuff on your beautiful cars,it's rubbish.

Posted by: JD - 27 June 2007 17:33:10
I'd heard its a bit aggresive. Too much ammonia in it or something?

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 27 June 2007 17:38:54
I think these products are top class. More expensive than T cut,but better results and more gentle on the finish.

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 27 June 2007 17:40:29
try this Strange can't get that pic to post but they are called R1,R2 and Finishing Glaze.They are made by a company called Restore.

Posted by: 48REME - 27 June 2007 17:56:26
To quote mrsherbie: Why dont you email The H.O. team to see if they would consider a special display of standard only beetles In a year by year lineup You are THE MAN with the MOST knowledge to pull a European group of these cars together, and I for one, would absolutely LOVE to see a lineup of these! I dont think this has ever been done before? We're going to try and do exactly that Anna! A Standard line up at Lavenham for starters and then who knows... This will involve British Standard owners first and then hopefully guests from abroad too. :D

Posted by: 48REME - 27 June 2007 17:56:26

To quote mrsherbie: Why dont you email The H.O. team to see if they would consider a special display of standard only beetles In a year by year lineup You are THE MAN with the MOST knowledge to pull a European group of these cars together, and I for one, would absolutely LOVE to see a lineup of these! I dont think this has ever been done before? We're going to try and do exactly that Anna! A Standard line up at Lavenham for starters and then who knows... This will involve British Standard owners first and then hopefully guests from abroad too. :D

Posted by: vintagevw - 27 June 2007 22:40:03
Yeah why not at Lavenham, my friend has a 1954 standard ragtop.

Posted by: Chris - 27 June 2007 23:35:42
[quote="48REME"] To my surprise, I actually had some hardcore enthusiast wondering why my square-window Standard Sunroof wasn't elegible when it was actually the only car of its kind in town as well as being one of only four around. [/quote] Nick, I've never considered myself a lover of square window bugs, but your car is VERY nice...

Posted by: mrsherbie - 28 June 2007 10:24:15
[img]https://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/361337.jpg[/img] Lets pray the king is not going to Bug In.... :(

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 16:27:45
Hi, no we do not take part at the Bug In. (BBT has lend the car from us ) The taxi will be restaured next year to stock ( like it left Rometsch 1952 as a split ) We discused in the HO team how we will make the show 2009 and we line up the cars like we had ( one street Oval , one street busses ,... ) but these cars have to be stock . Lowered cars with big engines and so on will be standing a other street seperated from stock cars. We are a vintage show and that is what we want to stay. Bye Christian

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 16:27:45

Hi, no we do not take part at the Bug In. (BBT has lend the car from us ) The taxi will be restaured next year to stock ( like it left Rometsch 1952 as a split ) We discused in the HO team how we will make the show 2009 and we line up the cars like we had ( one street Oval , one street busses ,... ) but these cars have to be stock . Lowered cars with big engines and so on will be standing a other street seperated from stock cars. We are a vintage show and that is what we want to stay. Bye Christian

Posted by: 2splits - 28 June 2007 16:46:09
[quote="fantakid"]Hi, no we do not take part at the Bug In. (BBT has lend the car from us ) The taxi will be restaured next year to stock ( like it left Rometsch 1952 as a split ) We discused in the HO team how we will make the show 2009 and we line up the cars like we had ( one street Oval , one street busses ,... ) but these cars have to be stock . Lowered cars with big engines and so on will be standing a other street seperated from stock cars. We are a vintage show and that is what we want to stay. Bye Christian[/quote] Amen. I will be there.

Posted by: 2splits - 28 June 2007 16:46:09

Posted by: 356boy - 28 June 2007 16:48:46
X2 see you there kevin, i'll let you buy me a drink :lol:

Posted by: pre67vw - 28 June 2007 16:52:26
[quote="fantakid"] Lowered cars with big engines and so on will be standing a other street seperated from stock cars. We are a vintage show and that is what we want to stay. [/quote] Thats what we like to hear!! I was beginning to worry... How are your parents now? Rob.

Posted by: lou cypher - 28 June 2007 16:58:43
[quote="fantakid"]Hi, no we do not take part at the Bug In. (BBT has lend the car from us ) The taxi will be restaured next year to stock ( like it left Rometsch 1952 as a split ) We discused in the HO team how we will make the show 2009 and we line up the cars like we had ( one street Oval , one street busses ,... ) but these cars have to be stock . Lowered cars with big engines and so on will be standing a other street seperated from stock cars. We are a vintage show and that is what we want to stay. Bye Christian[/quote] Hey Christian, This is what we want to here, I have been there since the beginning when it was low key with just a few cars in the square. even though it has now grown into the success that it has you have never let your standards drop, only raising the bar each time. WE KNEW WE COULD COUNT ON YOU YOUR THE MAN :lol: Maybe 356boy can buy everyone a 'Swedish kebab'

Posted by: lou cypher - 28 June 2007 16:58:43

[quote="fantakid"]Hi, no we do not take part at the Bug In. (BBT has lend the car from us ) The taxi will be restaured next year to stock ( like it left Rometsch 1952 as a split ) We discused in the HO team how we will make the show 2009 and we line up the cars like we had ( one street Oval , one street busses ,... ) but these cars have to be stock . Lowered cars with big engines and so on will be standing a other street seperated from stock cars. We are a vintage show and that is what we want to stay. Bye Christian[/quote] Hey Christian, This is what we want to here, I have been there since the beginning when it was low key with just a few cars in the square. even though it has now grown into the success that it has you have never let your standards drop, only raising the bar each time. WE KNEW WE COULD COUNT ON YOU YOUR THE MAN :lol: Maybe 356boy can buy everyone a 'Swedish kebab'

Posted by: 356boy - 28 June 2007 17:55:46
[quote] Maybe 356boy can buy everyone a 'Swedish kebab' [/quote] i dont think sinbad will be in HO :lol: :lol:

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 18:10:48
Hi, thanks - my parents are everyday getting better and my dad will get back home by end of next week and my mother in 3 weeks. The team from HO wants to set up the show like the last exaped with this new street were there will stand the lowered and modived cars. Its nice to see some of these cars but not in the row with stock cars. I know in some of these cars there are even more hours and money put in the restauration then in a stock car - this is why we want honour that and so we put up and this extra new street with displays. Who does not like these cars just not has to go in that street. Planning for our show 2009 has now started - if af any idea what we should change , what we should do, what you did not like,.. - please let us know - we are for everthing open. Bye Christian

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 18:10:48

Hi, thanks - my parents are everyday getting better and my dad will get back home by end of next week and my mother in 3 weeks. The team from HO wants to set up the show like the last exaped with this new street were there will stand the lowered and modived cars. Its nice to see some of these cars but not in the row with stock cars. I know in some of these cars there are even more hours and money put in the restauration then in a stock car - this is why we want honour that and so we put up and this extra new street with displays. Who does not like these cars just not has to go in that street. Planning for our show 2009 has now started - if af any idea what we should change , what we should do, what you did not like,.. - please let us know - we are for everthing open. Bye Christian

Posted by: pre67vw - 28 June 2007 18:24:18
[quote="fantakid"]Hi, thanks - my parents are everyday getting better and my dad will get back home by end of next week and my mother in 3 weeks. The team from HO wants to set up the show like the last exaped with this new street were there will stand the lowered and modived cars. Its nice to see some of these cars but not in the row with stock cars. I know in some of these cars there are even more hours and money put in the restauration then in a stock car - this is why we want honour that and so we put up and this extra new street with displays. Who does not like these cars just not has to go in that street. Planning for our show 2009 has now started - if af any idea what we should change , what we should do, what you did not like,.. - please let us know - we are for everthing open. Bye Christian[/quote] Glad to hear your parents will be home soon, best wishes to them both. HO was fantastic last time around, the only complaint I heard a few times was the facilities for the camping. But I'm hoping not to camp next time anyway :wink:

Posted by: pre67vw - 28 June 2007 18:24:18

[quote="fantakid"]Hi, thanks - my parents are everyday getting better and my dad will get back home by end of next week and my mother in 3 weeks. The team from HO wants to set up the show like the last exaped with this new street were there will stand the lowered and modived cars. Its nice to see some of these cars but not in the row with stock cars. I know in some of these cars there are even more hours and money put in the restauration then in a stock car - this is why we want honour that and so we put up and this extra new street with displays. Who does not like these cars just not has to go in that street. Planning for our show 2009 has now started - if af any idea what we should change , what we should do, what you did not like,.. - please let us know - we are for everthing open. Bye Christian[/quote] Glad to hear your parents will be home soon, best wishes to them both. HO was fantastic last time around, the only complaint I heard a few times was the facilities for the camping. But I'm hoping not to camp next time anyway :wink:

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 18:37:39
Hi, thanks that is also what we heard and we are trying to change that Bye Christian

Posted by: heb623 - 28 June 2007 19:45:04
[quote]The team from HO wants to set up the show like the last exaped with this new street were there will stand the lowered and modived cars. Its nice to see some of these cars but not in the row with stock cars. I know in some of these cars there are even more hours and money put in the restauration then in a stock car - this is why we want honour that and so we put up and this extra new street with displays. Who does not like these cars just not has to go in that street. Planning for our show 2009 has now started - if af any idea what we should change , what we should do, what you did not like,.. - please let us know - we are for everthing open. Bye Christian[/quote] THANK GOD for that!!! Also glad to hear your parents will be home soon, best wishes to them both. :twisted: ET

Posted by: heb623 - 28 June 2007 19:45:04

[quote]The team from HO wants to set up the show like the last exaped with this new street were there will stand the lowered and modived cars. Its nice to see some of these cars but not in the row with stock cars. I know in some of these cars there are even more hours and money put in the restauration then in a stock car - this is why we want honour that and so we put up and this extra new street with displays. Who does not like these cars just not has to go in that street. Planning for our show 2009 has now started - if af any idea what we should change , what we should do, what you did not like,.. - please let us know - we are for everthing open. Bye Christian[/quote] THANK GOD for that!!! Also glad to hear your parents will be home soon, best wishes to them both. :twisted: ET

Posted by: mrsherbie - 28 June 2007 20:08:47
Firstly it is [i]wonderful[/i] your parents will be back on their feet! that must have been some scary times for your family! Personally I disagree with giving an invite to [i]any[/i] modified cars at the worlds 'biggest and finest vintage show'. I think that if you do not deter these cars you may find you have as many in that special street as you do in the rest of the town. It may then just become a very big show with 'all vws' ( albeit very organised!) There are over 50 vw shows here in the uk each year! They are ALL now [i]all[/i] vws. It is the 'attitude' of some of the people who seriously modify their early cars just to get '[i] under the skin of the stockers [/i] that is what most people find so offensive. I am not being hypothetical here, I KNOW some people do this just to make an impact and provoke a reaction. (No, not everyone, of course there are good and bad people in every scene.) What happens if the floor scraping Papler shows up? That will sure as hell offend ALL the stockers. Its so rare though, so does it stay in the stock area? or with the modified cars? What about when someone modifies a pre49 car just to get instant fame? Its going to happen sometime. Some attention seeking pleb is sure to want to bask in that limelight. Hebs are already being done and we never thought that would happen. Its the unique meeting of so many [i]like minded[/i] people that we enjoy so much, which makes us drive so far! Camberg got 'watered down'. To a different degree Peppercorn also got watered down too. It happens fast and is [i]very[/i] hard to reverse. I have noticed that stock people are fickle. If they get upset just once they often just wont return again. Sorry my views probably appear stong and selfish. ( thats me :wink: :lol: ) You H.O. team are between a rock and a hard place. You cannot please all the people all the time. But at the end of the day, the health and the happiness of your family are the most important thing of all! :D

Posted by: mrsherbie - 28 June 2007 20:08:47

Firstly it is [i]wonderful[/i] your parents will be back on their feet! that must have been some scary times for your family! Personally I disagree with giving an invite to [i]any[/i] modified cars at the worlds 'biggest and finest vintage show'. I think that if you do not deter these cars you may find you have as many in that special street as you do in the rest of the town. It may then just become a very big show with 'all vws' ( albeit very organised!) There are over 50 vw shows here in the uk each year! They are ALL now [i]all[/i] vws. It is the 'attitude' of some of the people who seriously modify their early cars just to get '[i] under the skin of the stockers [/i] that is what most people find so offensive. I am not being hypothetical here, I KNOW some people do this just to make an impact and provoke a reaction. (No, not everyone, of course there are good and bad people in every scene.) What happens if the floor scraping Papler shows up? That will sure as hell offend ALL the stockers. Its so rare though, so does it stay in the stock area? or with the modified cars? What about when someone modifies a pre49 car just to get instant fame? Its going to happen sometime. Some attention seeking pleb is sure to want to bask in that limelight. Hebs are already being done and we never thought that would happen. Its the unique meeting of so many [i]like minded[/i] people that we enjoy so much, which makes us drive so far! Camberg got 'watered down'. To a different degree Peppercorn also got watered down too. It happens fast and is [i]very[/i] hard to reverse. I have noticed that stock people are fickle. If they get upset just once they often just wont return again. Sorry my views probably appear stong and selfish. ( thats me :wink: :lol: ) You H.O. team are between a rock and a hard place. You cannot please all the people all the time. But at the end of the day, the health and the happiness of your family are the most important thing of all! :D

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 20:18:44
Hi, thanks for the nice words - you are right - in a lot of the things you write and that will be our problem. We are a meeting that is for stock cars - but we cannot prove befor we see the car in person how is it ( orginal or not ) Our team did a good job the last time by putting up the cars and so they will 2009. We will not allow some guys to ruin the atmospare we had last time just because they want to become quick famous !. Bye Christian

Posted by: fantakid - 28 June 2007 20:18:44

Hi, thanks for the nice words - you are right - in a lot of the things you write and that will be our problem. We are a meeting that is for stock cars - but we cannot prove befor we see the car in person how is it ( orginal or not ) Our team did a good job the last time by putting up the cars and so they will 2009. We will not allow some guys to ruin the atmospare we had last time just because they want to become quick famous !. Bye Christian

Posted by: JD - 28 June 2007 20:40:14

Excellent news about your parents. Best wishes. [quote="mrsherbie"]Personally I disagree with giving an invite to [i]any[/i] modified cars at the worlds 'biggest and finest vintage show'. [/quote] So - playing devils advocate here (erm... as per standard operating procedure) - define modified? Abarth exhaust? Okrasa? Judson? Sauer und Sohn, or Theo Decker tuned motor? Boot rack? Radials? Wrong colour paint for the year? Non original towel rail bumpers? Lowered? Alloy wheels (even reeeaaally old ones)? Incorrect motor? 356 drums? Eyebrows?* This is that "line" that I asked about before. And now someone will be asked to draw it. And enforce it. A good idea for sure, but it needs to be thought about very carefully. *Anyone caught fitting eyebrows should face a hefty fine or short custodial prison sentence. "Awww, they`re so cute..." Blech!! :twisted:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 28 June 2007 20:56:19

I think I am missing something but I still dont understand the taxi. Fitting drop spindles and shiny wheels whilst promoting H.O. on the sides just gives out the wrong impression to me. If that doesnt give the idea of 'lowering anything is ok, nothing will :shock: :lol: ( I can see it now, VW30 chassis on Midland Wheels BRMs on a platform in the town square..) Only kidding!!!!! But then, I thought it was a slight error in judgement to take the TeufelHeb to Camberg. Maybe I am just taking things far too seriously! JD, the 'define the line' issue is almost an impossible task. My 50 does not have 'vw' paint! but is otherwise stock. Owens 50 is all stock bar 356 wheels and drums. But then if we lowered them, (NOT THAT WE WOULD!!*! :shock: :lol: ) they would be modified I guess?.. Wow it gets messy easily doesnt it?!! [quote="fantakid"] Our team did a good job the last time by putting up the cars and so they will 2009.[/quote] We all have 100% faith in your judgements all H.O. team! :D Right I am off to the garage to finish fitting my 51 bus reduction boxes to my car now to put it up in the air! oh, hang on..... :? :lol:

Posted by: 356boy - 28 June 2007 21:59:56

i'll be going to HO but in a modified vw :twisted: not sure which one yet but both are of show quality, i agree that there should be some sort of parking for this type of car as many people who attend the show only have these modified cars. like christian says if there well away from the stockers in there own designated area that should be fine. if theres no place for them they could end up mixed in with the stockers like BC and you wouldnt like that :( . where would everyone park who comes in a modified car? brrrmmm brrrmmm :wink: its nearly stock [ATTACH]1612[/Attach]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 28 June 2007 22:16:10
Dont worry, I'll bring my big hammer and we'll have that big grandma clock off there in a jiffy! :lol:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 28 June 2007 22:20:34
Hang on, I will just give the hammer to Jenny! I dont think it will make it as far as H.O. blocking her view out of the front window like that! :lol:

Posted by: 356boy - 28 June 2007 23:20:10
thats coming out anyway :D

Posted by: streetwagens - 28 June 2007 23:28:19

[quote="pre67vw"]. Too many knackered/lowered barn doors for my liking and sadly they were mostly all English. [/quote] I drove the 1100 mile round trip to Germany to see some rare cars, and as my bus was old enough, I thought that it might be interesting for some people to see one of only 2 surviving OG paint special order Olive Drab (726) barndoors known to exist in the world. And suprisingly I was right, people were interested. It was excellent for the people that dragged it out of the forest in 1994 to see the bus driving, they were very pleased that it is being used and... dare I say it enjoyed. Anyone that talked to me on the weekend was interested to chat about the hundreds of hours welding, time spent sourcing OG parts (Have you ever tried finding a front 22mm wheel cylinder for a barndoor? - thought not!) and the story of the bus and its interesting life. I met a lot of very interesting people through going to the show and turning up in a 'knackered' barndoor, perhaps if you wished to criticise me for turning up then you could have talked to me about it. In my naive mind I believed the show was about vintage volkswagens and the love of them, not 'its not shiny enough for us'. I talked to a lot of people from many nations over the weekend, and received many compliments on the hours spent putting the bus together to a 'useable' state - I do not profess to have carried out a restoration. I have assembled a vehicle I enjoy driving. However, I am as usual disappointed to find that on returning to the UK it is the Great British Nation that is first to criticise yet again. [img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1030310.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020608.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020600.jpg[/img] [img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020593.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020584.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020578.jpg[/img] [img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020573.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020459.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020435.jpg[/img] [img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020392.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020380.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1020223.jpg[/img] [img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1010983.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1010982.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_P1010962.jpg[/img] [img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_2004275b.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_dvw1.jpg[/img][img]https://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/th_DSCF0129.jpg[/img] I apologise in advance if my volkswagens offends again in future.

Posted by: pre67vw - 28 June 2007 23:43:20
:lol: quality. I liked your bus, I like original paint - there's nothing quite like it. I don't like huge patches of rusty metal where the OG paint has long gone, and I don't like slammed vehicles at a vintage event. Thats my opinion and I'm sorry if it offends you!!

Posted by: streetwagens - 28 June 2007 23:49:29

IMHO the definition between stock and modified can only be decided by the owner. Either they are striving towards originality and are looking to return to stock when the parts allow, or are happy to run modded and are looking to 'improve' on driveability. I'd call my '53 modified as its 12 volt, running a later gearbox on barndoor reductions, and (gasp!) a twinport. However to the untrained eye it looks stock, such is the illusion of its altitude. 22 barndoors there in total. Over 12 from the UK. Well done bus drivers. 8)

Posted by: streetwagens - 28 June 2007 23:58:40

[quote="pre67vw"] :lol: quality. I liked your bus, I like original paint - there's nothing quite like it. I don't like huge patches of rusty metal where the OG paint has long gone, and I don't like slammed vehicles at a vintage event. Thats my opinion and I'm sorry if it offends you!! [/quote] It was the 'knackered' that offended me. Stock means stock, but Camberg has exhibited a certain leeway in the past. Rikki's bus shouldnt get into a stock show if thats how its marketed. Stock/rare then maybe.

Posted by: pre67vw - 29 June 2007 00:22:45

[quote="streetwagens"] It was the 'knackered' that offended me. [/quote] I apologize for using this word in this generic context, I understand that you've put a lot of time and effort into your bus (I loved the tyres by the way and it was great to see that it wasn't lowered). For me, OG paint is great if its in good condition, once the rust starts breaking through then I'm more in favour of new paint. Not saying I'm right, just my opinion. From what I can see, most of the European cars had either OG paint or Shiny - it's the English that seem to hold the rat-look flag the highest and this also sometimes seems to spill over to their lifestyle [img]https://forums.pre67vw.co.uk/uploads/10284.jpg[/img] [quote="lou cypher"]I was around to see the disgraceful behaviour in the parking lot by these guys. When they left their rubbish behind a group of Germans passed, looking at the chair & empty cans, commenting that it was typical of Brits! [/quote] For me, these are the people who should go to Bug Jam and take their knackered bus with them. Sorry if that offends you.

Posted by: streetwagens - 29 June 2007 00:35:57
I'll be at Bug Jam, but for the racing, though not in my bus. Shame it clashes with Peppercorn. Land rover tyres, £35 each. Bargain. 8)

Posted by: pre67vw - 29 June 2007 00:38:24

[quote="fantakid"]Hi, thanks for the nice words - you are right - in a lot of the things you write and that will be our problem. We are a meeting that is for stock cars - but we cannot prove befor we see the car in person how is it ( orginal or not ) Our team did a good job the last time by putting up the cars and so they will 2009. We will not allow some guys to ruin the atmospare we had last time just because they want to become quick famous !. Bye Christian [/quote] So, The AwefülHeb - in the Heb line up or in the custom street? :wink:

Posted by: brille52 - 29 June 2007 09:44:14

Just let me tell you : I see it from the "Italian" point of view :wink: : the fellows from the UK are exactly the same as everybody else present at Bad Camberg : there is absolutely no reason to put "you" down or feel ashamed !!!??? For what ? For the behaviour of some "drunken" guys ? Black sheeps are everywhere....For your cars? If everybody would "think it" the same way, how boring it would be at the end..... I had a great time at Bad Camberg ! Ok, Hessisch is fascinating in another way, but you can`t compare it : just the location beats Camberg at the first strike ! But if I look back at the whole weekend, I would do it again without question !! There are so many things that I would like to say, but believe me,here comes the problem with the language: yeah,school-time is long,long gone! It was great to meet a lot of you! And you all looked the same as 4 years ago !! :D :wink: The VW`s keeps us young !!!! :wink: Without you people from the UK,Bad Camberg would not be the great event for us from the other countries : THAT`S FOR SURE ! Lavenham: let`s hope to be there in 2008 !! andreas 8)

Posted by: brille52 - 29 June 2007 09:47:11
Great memories :!: :lol: Fuel station in Bad Camber :!: andreas 8) [ATTACH]1620[/Attach]

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 10:22:38

[quote="brille52"]Just let me tell you : I see it from the "Italian" point of view :wink: : the fellows from the UK are exactly the same as everybody else present at Bad Camberg : there is absolutely no reason to put "you" down or feel ashamed !!!??? For what ? For the behaviour of some "drunken" guys ? Black sheeps are everywhere....For your cars? If everybody would "think it" the same way, how boring it would be at the end..... [/quote] I agree, it was never my point to put down the Brits, I have many, many british VW friends who would never dream of behaving in this manner. They are some of 'The best'. My point was that it only takes a few fools to spoil it for the true VW fans. these guys were asked to leave the camping in Limburg after the first night, then went on to drunken behavour at BC. :( Maybe it was alittle too much for them, I guess it was there first BC as they seem too young to have attended before. The word is that they are still floating around here in Europe to attend Bug In this weekend. Or maybe they are in hopsital now with alcohol poisoning. :wink: This behaviour has never been seen at HO and I hope it never will, I'm sure Christian & Co. will not stand for this! I guess they have their 15mins of fame now! :wink:

Posted by: 356boy - 29 June 2007 11:10:18

[quote]Just let me tell you : I see it from the "Italian" point of view : the fellows from the UK are exactly the same as everybody else present at Bad Camberg : there is absolutely no reason to put "you" down or feel ashamed !!!??? For what ? For the behaviour of some "drunken" guys ? Black sheeps are everywhere....For your cars? If everybody would "think it" the same way, how boring it would be at the end..[/quote] this was my first camberg and i loved it, even the wife did :lol: now that is a suprise, we met many very nice people. and the kebabs were good, :? so i'm told :roll:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 29 June 2007 11:13:31

[quote="streetwagens"]I thought that it might be interesting for some people to see one of only 2 surviving OG paint special order Olive Drab (726) barndoors known to exist in the world. And suprisingly I was right, people were interested. It was excellent for the people that dragged it out of the forest in 1994 to see the bus driving[/quote] It WAS fantastic to see this bus! I have never met you, but I wanted to shake your hand! Virtually every olive drab splitbus gets painted over :x I remember seeing this bus when it first arrived, and It was such a serious project I remember running away in fear! :shock: That original to date correct Swedish trellised pattern aluminium rear number plate is a rare and joyful sight! You are being humble, you have done far more to restore it than most shiny vw's ever need. Ditto the Wisk bus. Landy tires rock! :D I am part of the confused generation in the uk scene. The vintage side; I [i]love[/i] stock height being retained, but the cars nearly always get 'fully restored'. The OG side; original paint is [i]always king[/i], if your vw has any left (mine didnt :( ) But this is the ratty usually modified side of the scene that stockers dislike so much. There are so few buyers looking for an original 'patina' ( I feel a slap approaching from Rob :lol: ) vw, who wish to keep the car stock height, that we find ourselves looking to the Restocal & OG bus guys as buyers who will not over-restore what we value as a vehicle with 'special paint'. That old story of 'once the original paint is gone, its gone forever' applies. But then, I see Arrons brown samba and Deano's RHD DD BD both also [i]only just[/i] finished in time for Camberg! and I am gobsmacked at the full restorations, given what they both started with :shock: I think without seeing 'the before pics' sometimes we judge very unfairly. I know I do.

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 11:46:56
[quote="356boy"]i'll be going to HO but in a modified vw :twisted: [/quote] why not take the 356, you could park between these beauties, last seen at the 2001 HO. Will they still be allowed? does a 904 or Carrera class as modified? :? sorry 904 on next page :wink: [ATTACH]1608[/Attach]

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 11:48:36
[quote="lou cypher"][quote="356boy"]i'll be going to HO but in a modified vw :twisted: [/quote] here's the 904 from HO 2001. if modified VW's are allowed, then this HAS to be allowed, IT'S THE KING! :twisted: unless of course you are going to turn up in a 917 long tail with SMcQ driving. Now that would be something :lol: [ATTACH]1609[/Attach]

Posted by: pre67vw - 29 June 2007 12:26:58

[quote="mrsherbie"] There are so few buyers looking for an original 'patina' ( I feel a slap approaching from Rob :lol: ) vw, who wish to keep the car stock height, that we find ourselves looking to the Restocal & OG bus guys as buyers who will not over-restore what we value as a vehicle with 'special paint'. [/quote] Hmm, I'd say the Restocal guys have their fair share of over-restored VW's. 'Patina' and rust are two completely seperate things to me, patina is the result of time and use - rust is the process of your vehicle returning to the earth. Shiny paint is not a crime :wink:

Posted by: 48REME - 29 June 2007 12:39:30
I would say the contrary. People crave patina and prices reflect this: you often see Splits and Ovals advertised, mentioning how incredible it is that they are still in first paint. The superb middle blue Standard Oval in Bad Camberg attracted such a crowd because it had never been repainted. The same went for the one-owner from new Standard grey Oval parked at the entrance. :D

Posted by: JD - 29 June 2007 13:05:16

[quote="48REME"]I would say the contrary. People crave patina and prices reflect this: you often see Splits and Ovals advertised, mentioning how incredible it is that they are still in first paint. The superb middle blue Standard Oval in Bad Camberg attracted such a crowd because it had never been repainted. The same went for the one-owner from new Standard grey Oval parked at the entrance. :D [/quote] True, but like Rob said, how far do you let it go? "My car looks like a complete wreck, but by God its still original"? There is also the possibility to touch in paintwork, where the car was repaired, as per the back from the dead Samba. I think the green splitty was the only bus I photgrahed, for some reason. Its seemed to give the impression that it was a work in progress and would be a bit more finished off in future. I don't know.

Posted by: JD - 29 June 2007 13:26:04
[quote="Beeskow54"]Two years and 7000km after restoration Romy starts showing some beginning of patina and I love it ! So: restore if you have to but then make your own patina ! Build your own story ! [/quote] Amen to that!

Posted by: streetwagens - 29 June 2007 13:46:43

[quote="mrsherbie"] It WAS fantastic to see this bus! I have never met you, but I wanted to shake your hand! ! You are being humble, you have done far more to restore it than most shiny vw's ever need. Ditto the Wisk bus. Landy tires rock! :D [/quote] Thank you! 8) I think you almost met me when I was chatting to Owen at your car, and I think I have almost met you a few years ago when picking up a bus from your place. :wink: The bus is a work in progress, what you saw was all I had time to do before the show. i work away from home each week, so time to work on v-dubs is a little short. I still have metalwork ready to go on back at home, but now the bus is kept 95 miles away from my workshop - another problem!! Also its too tall to get it into a standard garage, so Im looking for storage for it near Bath while it sits in the driveway in front of a standard garage!! :roll: :lol: mrsherbie - the plate on the back is a part of the bus's history, thays why I put the UK plate on the roofrack. Hopefully the police in the UK wont make me take it off as its not classed as a legal plate anywhere now, and is not lit, so fingers crossed. A brief snapshot history - It was used by the Department for Road Works in Northern Sweden, then scrapped in '61, bought by a farmer, used in the fields, then the doors were welded shut, rear drums welded solid, and a hole punched throught the front to insert a drawbar. It was then dragged up into the mountains by a snowtrac and pushed down into the forest where it was used as a hunting lodge. In 1994 it was rescued by a Swedish collector and placed under cover. At the time it was considered a parts bus, nobody thought it was of any use. Luckily, some people thought differently. In 2002 it came to the UK, and then I bought it, and finally started working on it last November. Now she drives. :wink:

Posted by: 356boy - 29 June 2007 14:06:57

[quote="lou cypher"][quote="lou cypher"][quote="356boy"]i'll be going to HO but in a modified vw :twisted: [/quote] here's the 904 from HO 2001. if modified VW's are allowed, then this HAS to be allowed, IT'S THE KING! :twisted: unless of course you are going to turn up in a 917 long tail with SMcQ driving. Now that would be something :lol: [/quote] aarrgh!!! i think i'm going into overload :oops: :lol:

Posted by: streetwagens - 29 June 2007 14:09:54

[quote="356boy"][quote="lou cypher"][quote="lou cypher"][quote="356boy"]i'll be going to HO but in a modified vw :twisted: [/quote] here's the 904 from HO 2001. if modified VW's are allowed, then this HAS to be allowed, IT'S THE KING! :twisted: unless of course you are going to turn up in a 917 long tail with SMcQ driving. Now that would be something :lol: [/quote] aarrgh!!! i think i'm going into overload :oops: :lol: [/quote] you pork boys should have been in the Le Mans Classic last year - all the above racing flat out - pure unadulterated raw power being thrown around the track! 8)

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 14:49:21

[quote="streetwagens"]you pork boys should have been in the Le Mans Classic last year - all the above racing flat out - pure unadulterated raw power being thrown around the track! 8) [/quote] We were, we are and we do! we are also splitwindow beetle boys :lol: The point was that will these cars be allowed back to HO in 2009, back in 2001 when this photo was taken, they were parked next to the Grundmann's D&S (see pic) which was in the 'special bodies' display. if they are, then will the 'modified boys/girls demand entry? For me the porsche's should be allowed and the modified not! :twisted: That's only my view and not everyone will agree, but you can't please all the people all the time. :cry: someone has to be the big bad wolf and decide who is allowed and who not! I don't envy the HO team, they have one hell of a job. [ATTACH]1610[/Attach]

Posted by: brille52 - 29 June 2007 15:01:32
...every time I read " lou cypher ", I have a strange feeling..... :shock: :oops: :wink: andreas 8)

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 15:08:02
[quote="brille52"]...every time I read " lou cypher ", I have a strange feeling..... :shock: :oops: :wink: andreas 8) [/quote] You heard "The devil wears prada" but I bet you didn't know "The devil drives Aircooled" :wink: :wink:

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 15:08:38
[quote="brille52"]...every time I read " lou cypher ", I have a strange feeling..... :shock: :oops: :wink: andreas 8) [/quote] You heard "The devil wears prada" but I bet you didn't know "The devil drives Aircooled" :wink: :wink: Ooops sorry about that network problems overheating down here :twisted:

Posted by: streetwagens - 29 June 2007 15:32:04

[quote="lou cypher"][quote="streetwagens"]you pork boys should have been in the Le Mans Classic last year - all the above racing flat out - pure unadulterated raw power being thrown around the track! 8) [/quote] We were, we are and we do! we are also splitwindow beetle boys :lol: The point was that will these cars be allowed back to HO in 2009, back in 2001 when this photo was taken, they were parked next to the Grundmann's D&S (see pic) which was in the 'special bodies' display. if they are, then will the 'modified boys/girls demand entry? For me the porsche's should be allowed and the modified not! :twisted: That's only my view and not everyone will agree, but you can't please all the people all the time. :cry: someone has to be the big bad wolf and decide who is allowed and who not! I don't envy the HO team, they have one hell of a job. [/quote] Yep, wheres the line drawn? Different marque gets in but a modified rare volkswagen gets turned away? Can of worms. See you at the Classic next year!! 8) [IMG]https://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l317/airdiction/a86be643.jpg[/IMG]

Posted by: pre67vw - 29 June 2007 15:35:53
[quote="lou cypher"]but I bet you didn't know "The devil drives Aircooled" :wink: :wink: [/quote] So what's your connection to #56 - if any? :twisted:

Posted by: JD - 29 June 2007 15:43:17
Can't think where I saw it, but doesn't the 904 actually use one part from a Beetle? Something like an engine lid catch as a door handle? That is pretty modified for a Beetle though!

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 16:07:38
[quote="JD"]Can't think where I saw it, but doesn't the 904 actually use one part from a Beetle? Something like an engine lid catch as a door handle?[/quote] Yeah I think it does use something from a Beetle, "a duck doo"

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 29 June 2007 16:25:03
[quote="pre67vw"][quote="lou cypher"]but I bet you didn't know "The devil drives Aircooled" :wink: :wink: [/quote] So what's your connection to #56 - if any? :twisted: [/quote] Lou cypher must surely be Edwin from BBT. Thanks for you help Edwin (if it's you)with my problem -- TOP BLOKE :D

Posted by: 356boy - 29 June 2007 17:37:21

[quote="streetwagens"][quote="356boy"][quote="lou cypher"][quote="lou cypher"][quote="356boy"]i'll be going to HO but in a modified vw :twisted: [/quote] here's the 904 from HO 2001. if modified VW's are allowed, then this HAS to be allowed, IT'S THE KING! :twisted: unless of course you are going to turn up in a 917 long tail with SMcQ driving. Now that would be something :lol: [/quote] aarrgh!!! i think i'm going into overload :oops: :lol: [/quote] you pork boys should have been in the Le Mans Classic last year - all the above racing flat out - pure unadulterated raw power being thrown around the track! 8) [/quote] :lol: :lol: i was there, drove down in a silver 58 356 and i'll be there in 2008, maybe racing my own car :twisted: :lol: [ATTACH]1621[/Attach]

Posted by: 356boy - 29 June 2007 17:44:24
[quote="lou cypher"][quote="JD"]Can't think where I saw it, but doesn't the 904 actually use one part from a Beetle? Something like an engine lid catch as a door handle?[/quote] Yeah I think it does use something from a Beetle, "a duck doo"[/quote] i think the devils waiting for some dick to say whats "a duck doo" oh i just did :oops: quack quack :lol:

Posted by: 356boy - 29 June 2007 18:05:30
will there be a list of what is acceptable for HO :roll: [ATTACH]1622[/Attach]

Posted by: brille52 - 29 June 2007 18:37:12
....Edwin sounds much more better than that kind of " lo ucyp her ".. :wink: andreas 8)

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 18:48:54
[quote="'50 Karmann"][quote="pre67vw"][quote="lou cypher"]but I bet you didn't know "The devil drives Aircooled" :wink: :wink: [/quote] So what's your connection to #56 - if any? :twisted: [/quote] Lou cypher must surely be Edwin from BBT. Thanks for you help Edwin (if it's you)with my problem -- TOP BLOKE :D [/quote] No it's not Edwin, although I know him well and yes he is a top bloke :roll:

Posted by: pre67vw - 29 June 2007 18:58:47
[quote="lou cypher"] No it's not Edwin, although I know him well and yes he is a top bloke :roll: [/quote] Does the devil also have a green 11G?

Posted by: lou cypher - 29 June 2007 20:18:56
[quote="pre67vw"][quote="lou cypher"] No it's not Edwin, although I know him well and yes he is a top bloke :roll: [/quote] Does the devil also have a green 11G?[/quote] ummh don't thinks so, but if you want to sell your soul I can find you one :twisted:

Posted by: 356boy - 29 June 2007 20:28:08
this lou cypher sounds a bit of a softy to me, more like this [ATTACH]1613[/Attach]

Posted by: pre67vw - 29 June 2007 21:08:01
[quote="lou cypher"] ummh don't thinks so, but if you want to sell your soul I can find you one :twisted: [/quote] The prices these days, if I sold my soul I still wouldn't have enough :roll: So what car do you have?

Posted by: lou cypher - 30 June 2007 10:40:33
[quote="356boy"]this lou cypher sounds a bit of a softy to me, more like this [/quote] ah ah ah very funny! see you at le mans classic next year, I'll be the one waving as I pass you on the Mulsanne straight! :wink: what happened to the foto of the "Bunny mobile" :cry:

Posted by: 356boy - 30 June 2007 10:56:49

[quote="lou cypher"][quote="356boy"]this lou cypher sounds a bit of a softy to me, more like this [/quote] ah ah ah very funny! see you at le mans classic next year, I'll be the one waving as I pass you on the Mulsanne straight! :wink: what happened to the foto of the "Bunny mobile" :cry: [/quote] that was a rat look! :roll: and nobody passes sinbad on the Mulsanne straight! :lol: [ATTACH]1614[/Attach]

Posted by: 356boy - 30 June 2007 20:15:46
does anyone on hear attend classic le mans :twisted: [ATTACH]1615[/Attach]

Posted by: Donna Kebab - 30 June 2007 20:24:28

Some of us came along to Bad Camberg for the pure ride and the vision of the most beautiful cars in the world all in one place, and failed miserably when it came down to the detailed engine and parts talk :roll: . For me, Big Boys Bob made the trip, what he organized overwhelmed me-Thank You! Also, thanks to the people who realised and appreciated that people who are not familiar with the inside of VW-engines are humans to, and who with props such as cakes and general chats added a big bonus to a great trip! :roll: Blue coil top left :wink: [ATTACH]1623[/Attach]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 02 July 2007 07:13:38
Gosh we spend the weekend away 'A' hunting and come back to find this has turned into a porsche forum :lol: Always fancied Classic Le Mans. Goodwood Revival ( my local show) [img]https://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/gwood03.jpg[/img] [img]https://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/gwood2.jpg[/img]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 02 July 2007 07:39:53

[quote="pre67vw"]Hmm, I'd say the Restocal guys have their fair share of over-restored VW's. [/quote] Very true, they do love a lick of shiny paint :lol: But there are still far fewer original worn paint stockers around. They nearly always get restored. I am spending a few days mopping and waxing 2 rustfree buses just to encourage the new buyers to retain the excellent paint and not restore them. A respected friend and Veteran of classic vw events commented this weekend that he would prefer to see all pre67 vws. But only STOCK HEIGHT vws at these shows. I agree. I also think the height issue is the key issue. Pre67 or pre57, same rules. We will be on completely stock wheels for Lavenham.

Posted by: streetwagens - 02 July 2007 14:18:11
[quote="mrsherbie"]But only STOCK HEIGHT vws at these shows. I agree. I also think the height issue is the key issue. [/quote] Kinda ironic that my '53 bus is currently sat outside in the rain in front of a bone dry garage that its too tall to get into!!! :roll: :lol:

Posted by: JD - 02 July 2007 15:08:18

[quote="streetwagens"][quote="mrsherbie"]But only STOCK HEIGHT vws at these shows. I agree. I also think the height issue is the key issue. [/quote] Kinda ironic that my '53 bus is currently sat outside in the rain in front of a bone dry garage that its too tall to get into!!! :roll: :lol: [/quote] My pal lowered his fire truck for the same reason. Its still close! Wonder what the policy will be on [i]raised[/i] cars? :wink:

Posted by: lou cypher - 02 July 2007 16:34:43
[quote="JD"]Wonder what the policy will be on [i]raised[/i] cars? :wink: [/quote] What you mean like this? :shock: [ATTACH]1617[/Attach]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 02 July 2007 18:53:48

Just when I was starting to feel cheerful again! Feel free to tell me I am harping on like a broken record... but, what was the point [i]really in advertising H.O. at the Bug In?[/i] I'm just plain confused now :?: Gee, I [i]really[/i] hope all these cars show up.. [img]htt://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/theoandava/eurobugin123.jpg[/img] [img]htt://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/theoandava/eurobugin085.jpg[/img] [img]htt://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c232/theoandava/eurobugin055.jpg[/img] [img]https://img.villaephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/Foto-BPM3ZVO8.jpg[/img] [img]https://i28.phoobucket.com/albums/c232/theoandava/eurobugin051.jpg[/img] [img]https://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/Foto-BXMZVJ3N.jpg[/img] [img]https://img.villagepotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/Foto-Y7BJ4CKF.jpg[/img] [img]https://img.vilagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/Foto-I7USFTH4.jpg[/img] ps. The red car is a split..

Posted by: 356boy - 02 July 2007 19:39:53
bla bla bla! :lol: you said it!!! :twisted: [ATTACH]1618[/Attach]

Posted by: lou cypher - 02 July 2007 20:11:52
[quote="mrsherbie"] But only STOCK HEIGHT vws at these shows. Gee, I [i]really[/i] hope all these cars show up.. [/quote] what is all that about ?:shock: make your mind up stock or dumped :roll:

Posted by: 356boy - 02 July 2007 21:05:32
yeah! stock or dumped :twisted: :lol: :wink:

Posted by: JD - 02 July 2007 22:45:45
Yeah! What was the question again? I wouldn't worry about some of these turning up anyway. H.O. is still a few years away, and I think the bare metal fad will have taken its toll by then. Muppets. That taxi is badass though!

Posted by: mrsherbie - 02 July 2007 23:04:06
[quote="JD"]Yeah! What was the question again? I wouldn't worry about some of these turning up anyway. H.O. is still a few years away, and I think the bare metal fad will have taken its toll by then. Muppets. [/quote] :lol: :lol:

Posted by: lou cypher - 03 July 2007 21:40:07
[quote="JD"]Yeah! I wouldn't worry about some of these turning up anyway. H.O. is still a few years away, and I think the bare metal fad will have taken its toll by then. Muppets. [/quote] Thank god for that! if they do turn up I'm sure parking can be found for these "Rats" in the NEXT TOWN Hameln, after all the Pied Piper came from here, they should feel at home!

Posted by: vintagevw - 03 July 2007 22:24:52

[quote="mrsherbie"][quote="pre67vw"]Hmm, I'd say the Restocal guys have their fair share of over-restored VW's. [/quote] Very true, they do love a lick of shiny paint :lol: But there are still far fewer original worn paint stockers around. They nearly always get restored. I am spending a few days mopping and waxing 2 rustfree buses just to encourage the new buyers to retain the excellent paint and not restore them. A respected friend and Veteran of classic vw events commented this weekend that he would prefer to see all pre67 vws. But only STOCK HEIGHT vws at these shows. I agree. I also think the height issue is the key issue. Pre67 or pre57, same rules. We will be on completely stock wheels for Lavenham. [/quote] I agree for 100% with Mrs Herbie I was also at Bug Inn and have also respect for what they are doing with their cars, but ratlook is an cheap excuse for (not having a restoration or ........) and is also looking cheap. [ATTACH]1624[/Attach]

Posted by: Chris - 03 July 2007 22:33:39
That sure is one hell of a nice car !!! :D

Posted by: vintagevw - 03 July 2007 22:48:24
Yeah, once repainted (exterior)don't know for what reason) and only 13.000 original Kilometers. A gem

Posted by: 356boy - 03 July 2007 23:24:19
mmmmm! slam it, grandpop mirrors, chromed fuchs and a big f#@k off tack. sweeeet! :lol: only joking of course, very nice car 8)

Posted by: lou cypher - 04 July 2007 13:56:55
[quote="vintagevw"] I agree for 100% with Mrs Herbie I was also at Bug Inn and have also respect for what they are doing with their cars, but ratlook is an cheap excuse for (not having a restoration or ........) and is also looking cheap. [/quote] Hey is that not Willys car? :shock:

Posted by: 356boy - 04 July 2007 14:47:25
yes i think it is, willy from belguim, hello willy

Posted by: lou cypher - 04 July 2007 16:47:26

[quote="356boy"]yes i think it is, willy from belguim, hello willy [/quote] I think that this is Willys car, he has owned it for a couple of years now, I went to view the car when it was for sale, at the same time as Willy and we went together for a test drive. It does drive very nice and very straight, we were not 100% sure that it hadn't had a haircut, but it is for sure a very low milage split. (def not more than 50K) It has had the steering column and hand brake painted ivory (by dealer). It was a one owner from new car and with the car came some cool foto's of the happy couple just after they were married and had taken delivery of their new car! One other strange thing was the tyres, 16" Pirelis! have you ever seen these? They are the originals and the rubber is like bakerlite (good for burnouts) only joking. All the hardcore vintage boys have Continentals (if you can find NOS ones) I believe he still owns it (although I haven't spoken to him for a little while!) This was a Belgian car and I'm glad it stayed here and never went to "the pebble beach resto boys" :wink: :lol: :lol: [ATTACH]1619[/Attach]

Posted by: Scotty - 05 July 2007 14:28:42
On the subject of modified cars at Hessisch, can you remember who won best type 2 last time?

Posted by: lou cypher - 05 July 2007 14:34:24
[quote="Scotty"]On the subject of modified cars at Hessisch, can you remember who won best type 2 last time?[/quote] :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 05 July 2007 17:26:35

[quote="Scotty"]On the subject of modified cars at Hessisch, can you remember who won best type 2 last time?[/quote] Yes of course, Jules, and he was the first to be shocked and even quite embarassed to collect the award :shock: as his bus is lowered ( even though it is also beautiful!) But as we know the 'judging' was not done in the conventional sense there. Some guests were invited to pick their favorites I believe? Judging is a horrid burden. Who really wants to do it at such a high profile show as H.O. I always think its better to have no judging and no prizes. (But then I dont own a shiny car so maybe I dont know anyway) People just end up getting put out. For example the Restowagen guys talking about the judging at the Bug In right now. Can of worms.

Posted by: lou cypher - 05 July 2007 18:30:34
[quote="Scotty"]On the subject of modified cars at Hessisch, can you remember who won best type 2 last time?[/quote] You're not suggesting that HO is subjective, are you? :evil:

Posted by: Scotty - 06 July 2007 14:11:56

No, just merely pointing out that a modified bus won best type 2. I'm just a little bemused by some of the comments about 'vintage' cars on here. Sure the term vintage refers to the age of the vehicle not how high it is or what the paint finish is? Should I not bother taking my bus to any vintage shows because I've lowered it and not re-painted it? [img]https://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/362628.jpg[/img]

Posted by: lou cypher - 06 July 2007 14:34:32

[quote="Scotty"]No, just merely pointing out that a modified bus won best type 2. I'm just a little bemused by some of the comments about 'vintage' cars on here. Sure the term vintage refers to the age of the vehicle not how high it is or what the paint finish is? Should I not bother taking my bus to any vintage shows because I've lowered it and not re-painted it? [/quote] "Vintage" and "Stock" shows are two different things :wink: HO is a stock show, maybe they had a dispensation due to the fact that they were heading a convoy to Wolfsberg after the show :? Over to you Mr Sherbie :wink:

Posted by: pre67vw - 06 July 2007 14:45:36

[quote="Scotty"]No, just merely pointing out that a modified bus won best type 2. I'm just a little bemused by some of the comments about 'vintage' cars on here. Sure the term vintage refers to the age of the vehicle not how high it is or what the paint finish is? [/quote] 'Vintage' in the VW context is not just about age, its a section of the hobby just like cal-look, resto-cal etc. it refers to original or stock looking cars - the older the better. Its like turning up with a bone stock car and not understanding why you can't get in the line up of cal-look cars. Or parking in the line up regardless because your car is the same age. [quote="Scotty"]Should I not bother taking my bus to any vintage shows because I've lowered it and not re-painted it? [/quote] How you get to a vintage show is up to you :wink:

Posted by: pre67vw - 06 July 2007 14:55:21

[quote="lou cypher"] "Vintage" and "Stock" shows are two different things :wink: [/quote] I disagree here. The true definition of 'Vintage' is as a car built between the start of 1919 and the end of 1930, so officially there is no such thing as a vintage Volkswagen. The term was I think promoted in the US by the Vintage Volkswagen Club of America ([url=https://www.vvwca.com/]https://www.vvwca.com/[/url]) which originally concentrated on split window bugs. The term Vintage has become synonymous with stock, for example the annual 'Vintage' issue of HotVW's magazine was crammed full of stock cars, if vintage was purely the age of the car then every issue would be a vintage issue :D

Posted by: Scotty - 06 July 2007 14:56:05
Last time at HO modified stuff and stock stuff was parked next to each other and I never heard any complaints, it seemed not to matter as long as the vehicle was old enough. I can understand if that changes so that the stock stuff and the modified stuff is separated, that's up to the organisers.

Posted by: lou cypher - 06 July 2007 15:10:59
Now were cooking :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Posted by: pre67vw - 06 July 2007 15:22:33

[quote="Scotty"]Last time at HO modified stuff and stock stuff was parked next to each other and I never heard any complaints, it seemed not to matter as long as the vehicle was old enough. I can understand if that changes so that the stock stuff and the modified stuff is separated, that's up to the organisers.[/quote] The percentage of modified was very low, because the focus of the show was stock (as in vintage). As JD has raised before - what is modified? Okrasa motors, Judson superchargers are far from stock - but they're still vintage.

Posted by: 48REME - 06 July 2007 15:57:36

Every show nowadays, be it classic/vintage/stock or not, seems swamped with these lowered, loud, ratty buses and beetles. They want to be different from the norm but unfortunately they all end up looking the same. And that rusty unfinished look for me is just an excuse for cheap restoration. I believe it's a fashion of the moment which simply has no place in historic displays of unmodified vehicles. There are enough venues for that sort of cars. Sorry to offend but tough!

Posted by: 356boy - 06 July 2007 16:07:02

[quote]I disagree here. The true definition of 'Vintage' is as a car built between the start of 1919 and the end of 1930, so officially there is no such thing as a vintage Volkswagen. The term was I think promoted in the US by the Vintage Volkswagen Club of America (https://www.vvwca.com/) which originally concentrated on split window bugs. The term Vintage has become synonymous with stock, for example the annual 'Vintage' issue of HotVW's magazine was crammed full of stock cars, if vintage was purely the age of the car then every issue would be a vintage issue [/quote] well i agree with the captain :lol: :wink: but at HO there is obviously going to be alot of modified vw's, so why not put rat look in one street, resto in another, stock in another and so on, if theres signs showing where each catigory should be can there be a problem. then you dont have to look at the othe styles. over a full weekend i think its good to look around all types, at the end of the day we all enjoy the classic volkswagen, aaaaahhhhh. :roll: :lol: over to to you eeeeerrrrrmmmmm lou i suppose :)

Posted by: lou cypher - 06 July 2007 17:23:55

[quote="356boy"] but at HO there is obviously going to be alot of modified vw's, so why not put rat look in one street, resto in another, stock in another and so on, if theres signs showing where each catigory should be can there be a problem. then you dont have to look at the othe styles. over a full weekend i think its good to look around all types, at the end of the day we all enjoy the classic volkswagen, aaaaarrrrr. :roll: :lol: over to to you eeeeerrrrrmmmmm lou i suppose :) [/quote] I don't think that there are enough streets to do this. Maybe we are forgetting what HO stands for :wink: :wink: This used to be Hardcore Vintage/stock lets hope it doesn't go the way of BC! :evil: This thread could go on forever, it a hornets nest :twisted: :twisted:

Posted by: lou cypher - 06 July 2007 17:25:55

Posted by: 356boy - 06 July 2007 17:35:04
so where does everyone park and where would i park :cry: what you done to the screen lou:roll:

Posted by: lou cypher - 06 July 2007 19:00:53

[quote="356boy"]so where does everyone park and where would i park :cry: what you done to the screen lou:roll: [/quote] When you register in Ho you are issued with a sticker with a number,(for your windscreen,as BC) the stickers are different colours to correspond to which street (group) you are parked with. that's how it has been in the past :wink: Don't worry if your comin in the 55O you can park anywhere, I guess :wink:

Posted by: 356boy - 06 July 2007 21:25:46
but i cant register if i'm coming in the ragtop as its somewhat altered. where do all the other vw's who cant register park :roll: or do i register as a 57 and just turn up :twisted: which isnt quite fair. :( is it :twisted:

Posted by: lou cypher - 06 July 2007 21:52:11
[quote="356boy"]but i cant register if i'm coming in the ragtop as its somewhat altered. where do all the other vw's who cant register park :roll: or do i register as a 57 and just turn up :twisted: which isnt quite fair. :( is it :twisted: [/quote] Don't worry it's still a couple of years away :wink: You'll probably have a new toy by then, that can attend :wink:

Posted by: 356boy - 06 July 2007 22:33:14
no more cars for me :roll: if you have to register soon how do i know what i'll have then :roll:

Posted by: JD - 06 July 2007 23:41:29
Whats the cut off date anyway? `57 I suppose. Damn it. (Disgruntled owner of a `58 with small oval back window.)

Posted by: 356boy - 07 July 2007 09:51:34
that qualifies :lol:

Posted by: lou cypher - 08 July 2007 06:37:53
[quote="356boy"]no more cars for me :roll: if you have to register soon how do i know what i'll have then :roll: [/quote] :shock: Sell one of them, greedy! :twisted: :wink:

Posted by: 356boy - 08 July 2007 10:03:11
greedy! who me :twisted: the red stock ghia will be going when its finished :cry: to buy something else :lol:

Posted by: lou cypher - 08 July 2007 11:07:59
[quote="356boy"]greedy! who me :twisted: the red stock ghia will be going when its finished :cry: to buy something else :lol: [/quote] Yeah a T1 for HO :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :wink:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 09 July 2007 00:56:09

[quote="356boy"][quote]I disagree here. The true definition of 'Vintage' is as a car built between the start of 1919 and the end of 1930, so officially there is no such thing as a vintage Volkswagen. The term was I think promoted in the US by the Vintage Volkswagen Club of America (https://www.vvwca.com/) which originally concentrated on split window bugs. The term Vintage has become synonymous with stock, for example the annual 'Vintage' issue of HotVW's magazine was crammed full of stock cars, if vintage was purely the age of the car then every issue would be a vintage issue [/quote] well i agree with the captain :lol: :wink: [/quote] Yes I also agree with Rob about our modern mis-use of the term vintage. It simply identifies our group style in convenient general terms. [quote="356boy"] but at HO there is obviously going to be alot of modified vw's. [/quote] No! Why? H.O. and B.C. are the LAST 2 major meetings for stock vws in Europe. And this is the ONLY reason all the stock cars drive hundreds of miles from other countries to attend. To meet other STOCK cars and the people who own them. People from different countries who all share THE SAME IDENTICAL passion. [quote="356boy"] i think its good to look around all types [/quote] Yes, But not at these last 2 surviving stock shows. There are shows in every country every weekend. But we dont bother attending most of them? Why is that... I have had almost 20years of attending [i]all vw[/i] shows. But now I want to only park in a lineup of stock height cars. Thats what I like, and thats what I am bloodywell going to do! If that makes me some enemies then thats fine by me! :twisted: :D People seem to think that stockers 'dont mind' because they 'dont say anything' well, my observations having asked lots of stock people who are maybe 10 years and more older than myself, is that they are simply too polite to make comment. So the sad thing is that instead they just dont return to future shows. Look at Peppercorn. Where did all the nice old stock cars go? The answer is that they just stay at home instead. The only difference between us and those older stock vw owners is that we have a little more fight to keep our very small part of the scene the way we want it. 6V (and before anyone disputes this one, all my cars have always stayed 6v and always worked perfectly, there is no excuse to change, (unless you are laden down with accessories maybe! :lol: ) STOCK HEIGHT! For me a car doesnt have to be remotely 100% correct or pretty or shiny. Just these 2 things are enough. I could concede to 12v ok, but must be stock height. I have lots of very close modified friends who's vw's I like very much in their own right, and I am not saying people cant attend these shows in modified cars, but just that you shouldnt expect to be on display/part of a stock show if you dont fit the rules/criteria for that particular show. Someone tell me why people with lowered narrowed cars park up in the middle of a lineup of stock cars and think their car fits in there? :roll: We might not share their taste but at least the restowagen guys always have their own (and very well organised!) displays. They get it. Parking together with others of the same taste and views makes for a much better display. Lowered/modified is just not stock. Which ever colour sunglasses you look through 8)

Posted by: 356boy - 09 July 2007 07:29:53

[quote]No! Why? H.O. and B.C. are the LAST 2 major meetings for stock vws in Europe. And this is the ONLY reason all the stock cars drive hundreds of miles from other countries to attend.[/quote] i will also be travelling hundreds of miles, maybe in a modified car, if i do where do all the modified cars park, are they aloud in the town or do they hace to park miles away. [quote]We might not share their taste but at least the restowagen guys always have their own (and very well organised!) displays. They get it. Parking together with others of the same taste and views makes for a much better display.[/quote] this is another point i was making, there are going to be just as many modified cars going,you cant stop that i'm afraid, but it cant be hard to keep them together away from the stockers. at BC the organisers should have refused entry to the field for any modified car whether they had pre booked or not, the rules were set. :wink:

Posted by: Chris - 09 July 2007 10:39:59
[quote="356boy"] i will also be travelling hundreds of miles, maybe in a modified car, if i do where do all the modified cars park [/quote] To be honest, I don't give a toss where they park as long as it's not within the show. If I'd want to go to a modified show, I'd go to one in this country. HO is a stock show and that's how it should / must remain. :x Just like this site is. :wink:

Posted by: pre67vw - 09 July 2007 10:46:27

[quote="356boy"]i will also be travelling hundreds of miles, maybe in a modified car, if i do where do all the modified cars park, are they aloud in the town or do they hace to park miles away. [/quote] Not wishing to appear rude, but if you like modified cars so much, why hang out here? why go to H.O. at all? There are other shows with all VW's and Porsches and it sounds like you would enjoy them a whole lot more. If on the other hand you have a passion for stock, then drive to H.O. in your stock VW and take part, or go in your modified VW and leave it parked at your hotel.

Posted by: Chris - 09 July 2007 11:02:34

[quote="356boy"] i will also be travelling hundreds of miles, maybe in a modified car, if i do where do all the modified cars park, are they aloud in the town or do they hace to park miles away. [/quote] Looks like I've found somewhere for the modified cars to park... [img]https://www.santapod.co.uk/images/tital/santa_tital4.jpg[/img] Just think of the money you'll save on petrol. You can put it towards a 'proper' car... :wink:

Posted by: 356boy - 09 July 2007 11:25:18
like i say, i like all types off vw's. STOCK aswell as modified. i enjoyed the whole experience of BC so i will be going to HO :D met some nice people and seen some great cars. isnt that what its all about :roll: i'm not asking for it to be turned into a modified show. where does non stock cars park though.

Posted by: pre67vw - 09 July 2007 11:50:16
[quote="SDV"] To be honest, I don't give a toss where they park as long as it's not within the show. [/quote] :D

Posted by: JD - 09 July 2007 12:27:52
[quote="mrsherbie"] STOCK HEIGHT! [/quote] Like this...? :D :shock: [IMG]https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v259/Jameshdeath/18.jpg[/IMG]

Posted by: mrsherbie - 09 July 2007 12:52:27

[quote="SDV"]Looks like I've found somewhere for the modified cars to park... [img]https://www.santapod.co.uk/images/tital/santa_tital4.jpg[/img] [/quote] :lol: :lol: [quote="356boy"] this is another point i was making, there are going to be just as many modified cars going,you cant stop that i'm afraid, but it cant be hard to keep them together away from the stockers. at BC the organisers should have refused entry to the field for any modified car whether they had pre booked or not, the rules were set. :wink: [/quote] There wont be [i]huge numbers[/i] of modified cars going. Its a stock show. But I believe there will be more than last time. (Thanks Bug In for your help too :roll: ) If there is no provision for modified cars to attend I believe that this is what 100% of the stock attendee's would wish to happen. There doesnt need to be provision made. The stock visitors dont want to see modified cars here, they go to these 2 shows to see stock. All other vehicles would park in the visitors parking areas just around the perimeter of the central town which is closed off as last time. Its only minutes walking. I actually think the high numbers of uk modified buses are going to be slightly more of a headache for the organisers.

Posted by: mrsherbie - 09 July 2007 13:40:23

[quote="JD"][quote="mrsherbie"] STOCK HEIGHT! [/quote] Like this...? :D :shock: [IMG]https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v259/Jameshdeath/18.jpg[/IMG] [/quote] [img]https://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/beetle-sunset-Hayling1.jpg[/img] I had these ( not bought, taken in as a debt) Kept them on for about a year while I spent £500! re-furbing my stock wheels myself and with new firestone crossplies. I thought they looked pretty :D (even with the incorrect tyre combo and funny gaps) I didnt go and park it in a stock line up though while they were on. then : [img]https://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-3/1155935/crossplies-on-w.jpg[/img] :D I personally like Fuchs,356, genuine sprints on a stock height car. Trouble is, from gen sprints, to repro sprints, to MWS BRMs. Most people dont see the differences in principle between them. Herein lies the problem. Call it wheel snobbery if you wish! We are going to re-fit their original stock wheels and crossplies onto the samba(even the pretty old criss-crossy trim rings! :D ) and Owens 50 for Lavenham ( instead of their current gen sprints and gen 356) Its easy if you stay otherwise stock and stock height to play both games :wink: :D Imagine those 4.5 black detailed Fuchs you have, on crossplies, stock height on your black kab JD? I might be mad but I think that would be quite cool! We might lean stock but there's no reason not to have some period fun from time to time. I think for stock to stay alive within the younger stock crowd, sometimes a little fresh appeal is a good idea. But I am also sure many of you will be disagreeing with me with the reply that its 'stock vw wheels or nothing'. Maybe you are right and I am wrong.

Posted by: mrsherbie - 09 July 2007 13:45:14
ps. Just in case you notice, NZ OZ CKD beetles didnt ever have 2 tone wheels, only solid cream or solid silver in the 60's.

Posted by: JD - 09 July 2007 13:46:43
If "plan A" comes off, then I was wondering about finding a new home for my crossplys on a set of black and white painted 356C steels with hubcaps. Best of both worlds, as you say.

Posted by: lou cypher - 09 July 2007 14:16:42

Well Sinbad my old friend these are the options as I see them. :wink: If your going in the 356, maybe they will be allowed in? (that's up to the organisers) or you can either; Park the 356 in my garage and come with me. Park the 356 in my garage and I will loan you a vehicle that qualifies Park in the Hotel car park at HO and walk to the show.(that is if you stay in HO, I have learnt from experience that this is not a good idea, as you get the dickheads with stingers driving around all night trying to look cool, but hey, when have you ever seen a piece of shit look cool?). if you park in the hotel car park, you can still drive around the town and park outside the hall on the saturday evening. :wink: :evil: I AM rude so For all the modifieds and ratlook rusty beam scrappers, there is a crusher in the next town, they should all go there and make a coffee table out of their shitboxes, it will be a vast improvement. :twisted: :twisted: Through my sunglasses a piece of rusty lowered old shit is always a piece of rusty lowered shit and has no place at HO :lol: :lol: This is going to go on forever, I think that the only way to keep HO the way we know and love is for Rob to start a petition page for people to sign, then Christian will see, we need to stand up for our beliefs after what we all saw at BC :roll: HO is now the premier show we need to keep it that way, as Mrs herbie said "look what happened to peppercorn" :cry: If the shitboxes don't like it TUF :twisted:

Posted by: 356boy - 09 July 2007 14:36:22

[quote] I AM rude so For all the modifieds and ratlook rusty beam scrappers, there is a crusher in the next town, they should all go there and make a coffee table out of their shitboxes, it will be a vast improvement. [/quote] :lol: :lol: :lol: ok i'll have a stock car by then :twisted: [quote]All other vehicles would park in the visitors parking areas just around the perimeter of the central town which is closed off as last time. Its only minutes walking.[/quote] congatulations, thats what i've been asking all along. :)

Posted by: Scotty - 09 July 2007 14:45:33

[quote="48REME"]Every show nowadays, be it classic/vintage/stock or not, seems swamped with these lowered, loud, ratty buses and beetles. They want to be different from the norm but unfortunately they all end up looking the same.[/quote] Unlike a line up of restored black ovals? :wink: [quote="48REME"] And that rusty unfinished look for me is just an excuse for cheap restoration. [/quote] Yeah, that's it, spot on...... :roll: [quote="48REME"]I believe it's a fashion of the moment which simply has no place in historic displays of unmodified vehicles. There are enough venues for that sort of cars. Sorry to offend but tough![/quote] You are probably right, modified cars should be in a different line up, but if the car is old enough (which is what dictates whether you are allowed or not) then surely there should be a separate line up? I'm not trying to start an argument, please take note of the smilies.......

Posted by: lou cypher - 09 July 2007 14:51:08
[quote="Scotty"] I'm not trying to start an argument, please take note of the smilies.......[/quote] That's a good job then, cause your never gonna win. :twisted: :twisted:

Posted by: 356boy - 09 July 2007 14:51:50
[quote]If your going in the 356, maybe they will be allowed in? (that's up to the organisers) or you can either; Park the 356 in my garage and come with me. Park the 356 in my garage and I will loan you a vehicle that qualifies[/quote] just one problem there lou, i happen to know you dont have a garage :lol: :lol:

Posted by: lou cypher - 09 July 2007 14:55:00

[quote="356boy"][quote]If your going in the 356, maybe they will be allowed in? (that's up to the organisers) or you can either; Park the 356 in my garage and come with me. Park the 356 in my garage and I will loan you a vehicle that qualifies[/quote] just one problem there lou, i happen to know you dont have a garage :lol: :lol: [/quote] Building new one, will be finished by then. will post picture on garage page. :wink:

Posted by: 48REME - 09 July 2007 15:57:08

To quote Scotty: Unlike a line up of restored black ovals? That is why I think a 1957 cut-off date for cars allowed in is stupid. The sight of dozens of ovals and splits doesn't make these particularly rare. I get the feeling that if it's 'old' (in the acceptable pre-57 way) then it's OK, otherwise, forget it! I remember this friend of mine, a young Belgian, who was nearly refused entrance to the Bad Camberg display four years ago, although he had a one-off coachbuilt Beetle estate van, very similar to the Meussen coachbuilt estates of the 50s. Ahh, but his car was from 1966, so it nearly didn't deserve to sit next to the usual pick of acceptable cars. As Scotty implies, it's probably far more interesting to see a row of ovals or something instead! People are now brainwashed with the idea that age equals rarity. I just say it's plain ignorance and snobbery....and it's what fuels crazy price trends too! Where are the true classic VW enthusiasts and connoisseurs these days? :shock: [ATTACH]1625[/Attach]

Posted by: 356boy - 09 July 2007 18:04:29
X2 :lol:

Posted by: JD - 09 July 2007 18:25:27
I'm with you guys - and I'll take "interesting" over strictly age limited or strictly original any day.

Posted by: mrsherbie - 09 July 2007 18:48:07

[quote="48REME"]People are now brainwashed with the idea that age equals rarity. I just say it's plain ignorance and snobbery....and it's what fuels crazy price trends too! Where are the true classic VW enthusiasts and connoisseurs these days? :shock: [/quote] I agree with you completely ( apart from the unrestored v restored paint thing) But, when space is limited at a show venue there have to be some rules/guidelines/criteria. Its not always possible to find space for 1940-1967 all vws. In the uk there arent so many stock 60's beetles left that it would be a problem in my view, in fact thats what I am looking forward to seeing most at Lavenham, and I'm taking my 63 too. I cant wait to see lots of stock '58 and '59 cars in those great 1/2 year only colours!!! :D :D I think it would be better at H.O. to have a street filled with 58-67 stock only cars instead of the street of modified cars. But thats just my opinion. I know the H.O. team will make it work one way or another!

Posted by: lou cypher - 09 July 2007 19:01:52

[quote="48REME"] That is why I think a 1957 cut-off date for cars allowed in is stupid. [/quote] :shock: Why? [quote="48REME"] The sight of dozens of ovals and splits doesn't make these particularly rare. [/quote] No it doesn't, but where else do you go to see as many Splits, Ovals, Kübels ,Schwims etc? Or may be that is an everyday sight where you live. Also the question is, did you think this way when you had the '48? I know you have a rare car now, but it's not a Split or an Oval. That is what HO is, or shall we just make it like the rest of the VW shows? I agree the estate should be allowed as it is a coachbuilt. [quote="48REME"] Where are the true classic VW enthusiasts and connoisseurs these days? :shock:[/quote] I think that is an insult to the Grundmanns, so they are not true VW enthusiasts? They open their private museum to us all and lend their cars free of charge to the Wolfsburg museum.They put in endless hours organising a show for us to attend. So if I had the last mexican beetle produced, then that would be ok to take this and park next to the splits, after all it's rare! At the end of the day we can all get on our soap boxes but the rules are the rules. No one is forcing you to go :wink:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 09 July 2007 19:23:30

[quote="lou cypher"][quote="48REME"] That is why I think a 1957 cut-off date for cars allowed in is stupid. [/quote] :shock: Why? [quote="48REME"] The sight of dozens of ovals and splits doesn't make these particularly rare. [/quote] At the end of the day we can all get on our soap boxes but the rules are the rules. [/quote] You are right and make a good point. At Stonor park this year there were how many stock ovals on the show field? 2?! How many splits? no stock, 1 resto? Apart from Stanford Hall ( I didnt go this year) you wont see more than a 1 or 2 splits and a few ovals(non ratters) at any of the uk shows. I cant remember the last time I saw a line up of black stock ovals anywhere outside of H.O. or Camberg. Friends from NZ always travel over for the German shows and its not to see 60's beetles. They have lots of those but only a handful of split beetles in all Australasia.

Posted by: lou cypher - 09 July 2007 19:32:33
[quote="mrsherbie"] Friends from NZ always travel over for the German shows and its not to see 60's beetles. They have lots of those but only a handful of split beetles in all Australasia. [/quote] Thats true, I also know people from NZ who are restoring early splits, this is one of the only places they can go to check originality details. :wink:

Posted by: 48REME - 09 July 2007 20:44:38
Oh so you don't mind that the coachbuilt estate gets in even though that doesn't conform to the very 'rules' which outlawed in the first place? Careful now, you might be 'outruled' by some for thinking outside the 'rules'! Maybe it's time to enforce some of your 'rules' on this site and pressurise it into being called Pre 57 then! Honestly...Is this what this hobby is coming to now? :lol:

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 09 July 2007 20:49:18
[quote="48REME"]Maybe it's time to enforce some of your 'rules' on this site and pressurise it into being called Pre 57 then! [/quote] What a great idea :wink:

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 09 July 2007 20:57:56

Before you get all excited Nick,i know where you're coming from. I too would rather see your car at BC or HO instead of all the Pikey buses that are invading.Even if they are pre '57. But the majority of people commenting on this matter do not realise just how rare your car is. So if thats the case, their opinion does not count,so take consolation in the fact that you are right but i'm afraid they will never see it.

Posted by: lou cypher - 09 July 2007 21:22:11

[quote="'50 Karmann"][quote="48REME"]Maybe it's time to enforce some of your 'rules' on this site and pressurise it into being called Pre 57 then! [/quote] What a great idea :wink: [/quote] Works for me :lol: :lol: anyway do I really honestly care what anyone thinks, I can go to my garage and have a choice of car than WILL qualify and no, they are not rusty shitboxes :lol: :lol: :lol: I guess that makes me an ignorant snob Lucky me :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink: And yes, I do know how rare your car is, but it's not pre '57 is it :wink:

Posted by: '50 Karmann - 09 July 2007 22:27:18

Why the magic figure of Pre '57? Why not Pre '53? Or lets get really snobby why not Pre march '49. I'll still be there, car on the register. Me and about 6 others,that would make a great show wouldn't it. (i'm sure hundreds would travel thousands of miles to see it) I think,HO in mind i would rather see a street filled with these later rarer cars,than a street filled with earlier modified vehicles. Modified cars should not be let within 10Kms of the town. H.O beside Lavenham(if it goes ahead) is our last total stock show,so if i were the supreme decision maker at H.O i would have all modified cars turned away.Along with crazy Belgians :wink: :wink: :wink:

Posted by: pre67vw - 09 July 2007 23:25:56

[quote="48REME"]Oh so you don't mind that the coachbuilt estate gets in even though that doesn't conform to the very 'rules' which outlawed in the first place? Careful now, you might be 'outruled' by some for thinking outside the 'rules'! Maybe it's time to enforce some of your 'rules' on this site and pressurise it into being called Pre 57 then! Honestly...Is this what this hobby is coming to now? :lol: [/quote] Bad Camberg entry requirements: Brezel- und Oval-Käfer - Typ 2 bis Produktionsdatum 28.02.1955 und Fahrgestell-Nr. 20 – 117901 - Typ 128 und 166 VW Schwimmwagen - Typ 82 VW Kübelwagen 1940 – 1945 - Sonderkarosserien und –aufbauten bis 1967 The estate gets in as a special body up to '67 :wink:

Posted by: JD - 09 July 2007 23:37:40

[quote="pre67vw"][quote="48REME"]Oh so you don't mind that the coachbuilt estate gets in even though that doesn't conform to the very 'rules' which outlawed in the first place? Careful now, you might be 'outruled' by some for thinking outside the 'rules'! Maybe it's time to enforce some of your 'rules' on this site and pressurise it into being called Pre 57 then! Honestly...Is this what this hobby is coming to now? :lol: [/quote] Bad Camberg entry requirements: Brezel- und Oval-Käfer - Typ 2 bis Produktionsdatum 28.02.1955 und Fahrgestell-Nr. 20 – 117901 - Typ 128 und 166 VW Schwimmwagen - Typ 82 VW Kübelwagen 1940 – 1945 - Sonderkarosserien und –aufbauten bis 1967 The estate gets in as a special body up to '67 :wink: [/quote] So is my `58 and your `65 Karmann Beetle considered a "special body" or just too downright common?

Posted by: streetwagens - 10 July 2007 00:20:13

[quote="48REME"]Every show nowadays, be it classic/vintage/stock or not, seems swamped with these lowered, loud, ratty buses and beetles. They want to be different from the norm but unfortunately they all end up looking the same. And that rusty unfinished look for me is just an excuse for cheap restoration. I believe it's a fashion of the moment which simply has no place in historic displays of unmodified vehicles. There are enough venues for that sort of cars. Sorry to offend but tough![/quote] Had it occurred to you that the 'rusty unfinished look' could be exactly that? a work in progress? My '53 is not restored, and will not be while it is in my posession. I have merely done what it needs to make it safe and legal, and made it useable. Damn right im not going to pour £20k into restoring it because thats not why i like 'old cars' - I like them because they feel old, they have history, they live and breathe and will continue to do so. I also have a very straight and rust free '55 panel, that has been restored, bare metalled etc etc, and I am selling it because it does not have what I desire in old cars. If I were to restore the '53, I would purge it of all its history, drain its soul from its tin, and end up with a precious expensive toy that I couldnt park anywhere or use without thinking that it would get damaged in some way. I think of car shows as an interesting array of old machinery, not a 'display' as such, bring on the variety I say. :wink: Im with the modified guys on this, as my bus is modified, as the trained eye will be able to tell. :wink: [IMG]https://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i195/streetwagens/P1030350.jpg[/IMG]

Posted by: streetwagens - 10 July 2007 00:23:48
[quote="'50 Karmann"].........l the Pikey buses that are invading.Even if they are pre '57........ [/quote] Strangely you didnt seem to express this opinion on my bus when you were talking to me at the show...

Posted by: pre67vw - 10 July 2007 00:53:05
[quote="JD"] So is my `58 and your `65 Karmann Beetle considered a "special body" or just too downright common?[/quote] I think people would much rather look at candy flip front Hebs and rusty lowered busses with bling wheels than a couple of 'late' model cabrios.

Posted by: 356boy - 10 July 2007 08:15:21
tinternet has ruined alot of things, unless like you say theres a show for a chosen few organised betwwen yourselves then your always going to attract the wrong sort. if HO is to be a stock success then the organisers have to be very strict, even if registered people turn up modified cars they should be turned away without refund. it could mean your own masonic lodge :lol: tickle tickle :wink:

Posted by: mrsherbie - 10 July 2007 11:27:48

[quote="streetwagens"]My '53 is not restored, and will not be while it is in my posession. I like them because they feel old, they have history, they live and breathe and will continue to do so. I also have a very straight and rust free '55 panel, that has been restored, bare metalled etc etc, and I am selling it because it does not have what I desire in old cars. If I were to restore the '53, I would purge it of all its history, drain its soul from its tin, and end up with a precious expensive toy that I couldnt park anywhere or use without thinking that it would get damaged in some way. I think of car shows as an interesting array of old machinery, not a 'display' as such, bring on the variety I say. :wink: [/quote] I have been driving my 63 this week before I take her apart shortly to repaint her (she was repainted once, pearl white in the 70's over the Ruby red which was faded (typical of high UV in NZ/OZ) I have always intended to do this but never wanted to own a fresh shiny car since I spent a fortune on one years ago which was key scratched within weeks and I really didnt enjoy that new paint one bit. It has taken me 15yrs to get back to the point of being prepared to try owning shiny paint again with all the worry it entails. The biggest thing I have enjoyed this week is how the car smells inside, not how it looks. Lovely old and original. musty :D The saving grace with my 50 being fully restored and repainted was the original interior. smelly again. great! Although the mouse nests inside the rear seat back constantly drop seeds, dry grass and mouse droppings on the floor. Mixed with the constantly shedding hair from Butty the reindeer on the back seat, I am hoovering far more than I had foreseen :shock: :lol: Owens car will I know irritate many stockers with its surface rust, like your green bus. But how many 50 sunroofs are there left in original paint? We'd rather have ours over that Rich's50 anyday! There are no allen headed stainless bolts on ours :shock: Unrestored over restored anyday. But of course with most cars that have been restored before you dont get the luxury of this choice(ie my 63) So you have to restore or leave it as is with wrong coloured/dodgy acrylic old paintwork?! Variety IS the key. But new junk like KCW and made in china tat has no historically interesting place on these cars. Thats why modified is out on these type of early vehicles for me. :shock: By the way, Hello Donna Kebab! :D

Posted by: 356boy - 10 July 2007 16:54:33
i will adjust my front beam back to stock for HO :lol: who's donna kebab? :roll:

Posted by: Chris - 10 July 2007 17:49:24

I don’t usually get involved with the in-depth threads, as I like to have a laugh and not take things too seriously. But I’m now bored with all the discussion about what should be eligible for HO and thought I’d have my penny’s worth. Firstly, this is a pre67 website catering for stock vehicles. It’s not meant for the Cal lookers or the Restocal brigade, they have their own sites. Having said that, it doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate RestoCal cars, some are really nice and the amount of work gone into them is tremendous, but if I wanted to see pictures of them or discuss them I’d go onto their website. To be honest, the same can be said for Porsches. I like stock, pre 67 volkswagens, that’s why I post here. Secondly, Hessisch Oldendorf. Let’s be honest, Christian and co. put on what is without doubt the best (vintage) show in the world. It has been for a number of years now and I think he knows a winning formula when he sees one. Yes, we’d all like it be specific to our own tastes and in my own opinion I’d like to see stock vehicles only. But that’s all it is, my opinion. We all have one, if everyone thought the same, what a boring place it would be. Arguing over what should be allowed isn’t getting anybody anywhere; it’s like the Chuckle Brothers on here, T’me, T’you, T’me, T’you. He has a criteria for the show and people should respect that. If your car is not eligible, then I’m sorry but you know the rules, and no matter how nice your car is, or rare, no matter what we say on here, they’re the rules. There’s not a lot we can do to change things and yes, I know Christian posts on here, but I don’t think this thread will influence him much. If people have to drive their lowered cars or buses to the show, fine, but leave them in the car parks on the edge of town. As stated previously, we wouldn’t take our stock cars to a modified show, it wouldn’t fit in. HO is one of the last true vintage/stock shows there is in Europe, why can’t people accept it for what it is, a show for vintage enthusiasts put on by vintage enthusiasts. If people don’t want to see rows of black ovals then don’t go. I don’t want to see modified cars so I don’t go to BugJam or the VolksWorld show, it’s as simple as that. I spoke to a couple of people on the ferry to BC and they didn’t have a clue what BC was about. They were only going because it was Bad Camberg, the name drew them. On the return journey, they expressed how disappointed they were in the show as it was full of Stock cars and no modified stuff. IMHO, good, let’s hope they don’t come to HO. Or if they do, they know what to expect. The same can be said of the proposed Lavenham show. A criteria for vehicles has been laid down, pre 67 stock Volkswagens only. It can’t be much clearer than that. If your car has been lowered then please don’t expect to show it. Park it in one of the visitor car parks by all means, but not in the town square. Sending a picture of your car when you register is one way of vetting the applicants. Turning them away at the entrance without a refund is another. They’ll soon get the message. Should they have done that at BC, well we could discuss that for ever. As stated earlier, T’me, T’you, T’me, T’you. There, said it. Now can we have the next topic please……….

Posted by: JD - 10 July 2007 18:04:43
Stock - can't get much clearer than that? Really? No Okrasa then. No Judsons. No 356 drums...and so on... been here before haven't we? How fascistic do you want to get about what "stock" is? Do you want to draw the line or shall I? Lets just let the Grundmanns do their stuff. It'll be great I'm sure.

Posted by: pre67vw - 10 July 2007 18:26:04

[quote="SDV"]I don’t usually get involved with the in-depth threads, as I like to have a laugh and not take things too seriously. But I’m now bored with all the discussion about what should be eligible for HO and thought I’d have my penny’s worth. Firstly, this is a pre67 website catering for stock vehicles. It’s not meant for the Cal lookers or the Restocal brigade, they have their own sites. Having said that, it doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate RestoCal cars, some are really nice and the amount of work gone into them is tremendous, but if I wanted to see pictures of them or discuss them I’d go onto their website. To be honest, the same can be said for Porsches. I like stock, pre 67 volkswagens, that’s why I post here. Secondly, Hessisch Oldendorf. Let’s be honest, Christian and co. put on what is without doubt the best (vintage) show in the world. It has been for a number of years now and I think he knows a winning formula when he sees one. Yes, we’d all like it be specific to our own tastes and in my own opinion I’d like to see stock vehicles only. But that’s all it is, my opinion. We all have one, if everyone thought the same, what a boring place it would be. Arguing over what should be allowed isn’t getting anybody anywhere; it’s like the Chuckle Brothers on here, T’me, T’you, T’me, T’you. He has a criteria for the show and people should respect that. If your car is not eligible, then I’m sorry but you know the rules, and no matter how nice your car is, or rare, no matter what we say on here, they’re the rules. There’s not a lot we can do to change things and yes, I know Christian posts on here, but I don’t think this thread will influence him much. If people have to drive their lowered cars or buses to the show, fine, but leave them in the car parks on the edge of town. As stated previously, we wouldn’t take our stock cars to a modified show, it wouldn’t fit in. HO is one of the last true vintage/stock shows there is in Europe, why can’t people accept it for what it is, a show for vintage enthusiasts put on by vintage enthusiasts. If people don’t want to see rows of black ovals then don’t go. I don’t want to see modified cars so I don’t go to BugJam or the VolksWorld show, it’s as simple as that. I spoke to a couple of people on the ferry to BC and they didn’t have a clue what BC was about. They were only going because it was Bad Camberg, the name drew them. On the return journey, they expressed how disappointed they were in the show as it was full of Stock cars and no modified stuff. IMHO, good, let’s hope they don’t come to HO. Or if they do, they know what to expect. The same can be said of the proposed Lavenham show. A criteria for vehicles has been laid down, pre 67 stock Volkswagens only. It can’t be much clearer than that. If your car has been lowered then please don’t expect to show it. Park it in one of the visitor car parks by all means, but not in the town square. Sending a picture of your car when you register is one way of vetting the applicants. Turning them away at the entrance without a refund is another. They’ll soon get the message. Should they have done that at BC, well we could discuss that for ever. As stated earlier, T’me, T’you, T’me, T’you. There, said it. Now can we have the next topic please………. [/quote] Seems to me like a perfect place to leave this thread...

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