My 1953 standard oval came with m-code 001, according to thesambe.com this includes....
Chrome bumpers, hub caps, tail pipes, front flashing
indicators, hood and door handles; additionally with
moldings and passenger sun visor
up to Chassis No. 117 999 000
can someone tell me what the "mouldings" are classed as please?
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 04 January 2009 16:36:00
The description you have for M001 is for 55 and later cars. The earlier description for M001 that applied to your car would have been without the flashing indicators. M001 was an 'upgrade' option for Standard models (as far as I'm aware). The moulding would be the chrome trim on the bonnet, doors and side panels.
Posted by: VW Stan - 04 January 2009 18:33:43
My '58 Uk Std lists:
M 001
Chrome-plated bumpers, hub caps, outlet pipes, front indicator lights, tank cap and door handles;
in addition with trim strips and passenger sun visor
M 018
Larger reflector in brake/indicator light
M 020 Mph speedometer
M 008, 042, 063 and 108 cannot be identified
It has never had any chrome side trim so I expect 'trim strips' is something else - could be the white coach line painted on some standards?
It also hasn't got a passenger sun visor and the drivers visor is an after-market one.
The Color is listed as L243 Diamond Gray but it's actually Jupiter Grey!
So don't believe everything on a birth certificate especially for a standard!
:d
Posted by: Judson53 - 04 January 2009 18:58:49
Have you got any pics of your car would be intresting to see what chrome ive got that u havent :roll:
Posted by: VW Stan - 04 January 2009 21:41:28
Mine looks the same as the 60 UK Std pictured in this thread...
[url=https://forums.pre67vw.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=16359]https://forums.pre67vw.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=16359[/url]
Posted by: RoRoVw - 05 January 2009 09:05:53
[quote=VW Stan]Mine looks the same as the 60 UK Std pictured in this thread...
[url=https://forums.pre67vw.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=16359]https://forums.pre67vw.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=16359[/url][/quote]
Hi,
The 1960 pictured at the NEC is mine (formerly owned by Richard Copping of VW Motoring and many other publications fame). This car has black tail pipes, rather than chrome. Is yours the same? I believe black is correct but once again according to your 1958's 'Birth Certificate' they should be chrome.
As you say, mine is like yours, never had any side or bonnet trim or trim on the running boards but has the white coach line down either side. This has been repainted but it did have the lines originally.
It has only a driver's side green perspex sun visor.
Rob.
Posted by: blendfunctionwithform - 12 January 2009 20:16:15
Evening Ladies/Gents,
Just recieved my cars identity details from the VW museum, i was surprised to see that it was ordered with indicators, what indicators would these be? Also M018 Large reflector in brake/indicator light.
My std also has never had chrome trim on its panels(all be it the bonnet is not correct for the car, currently trying to source a new one) I have no visors at all, presume the white stripes have been painted over, still got my cable brakes and no synchro tho!
Are people aware of what M008, M063 & M108 are? Thank you for any help that follows, find bellow pictures of my 55 British RHD std that i have given its first clean having braved the winter in it.
Cheers
[IMG]https://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww137/blendfunctionwithform/S4023818.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww137/blendfunctionwithform/S4023805.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://i713.photobucket.com/albums/ww137/blendfunctionwithform/S4023821.jpg[/IMG]
Posted by: VW Stan - 12 January 2009 21:26:42
[quote=blendfunctionwithform]Evening Ladies/Gents,
Are people aware of what M008, M063 & M108 are? Thank you for any help that follows, find bellow pictures of my 55 British RHD std that i have given its first clean having braved the winter in it.
Cheers
[/quote]
Hi,
You can see from my post above that my '58 standard has the same unknown M code options as your '55.
I wonder, Are these are specific to RHD, Standards, UK spec, or what?
Anyone got a deluxe, or LHD Standard with these codes?
This might help to work out what they might be!
:d
[ATTACH]2388[/Attach]
Posted by: 55Kab - 12 January 2009 22:13:27
[quote=blendfunctionwithform]my 55 British RHD std[/quote]
H'mmmmmmmmmm, 55 UK std, very nice car sir and of course very rare.
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 13 January 2009 13:34:40
I'm pretty sure now that 'trim strips' mean painted lines, rather than chrome trim. My mistake.
Posted by: harveypj - 13 January 2009 14:21:04
[quote=VW Stan]
I wonder, Are these are specific to RHD, Standards, UK spec, or what?
Anyone got a deluxe, or LHD Standard with these codes?
This might help to work out what they might be!
:d
[/quote]
My RHD 58 Deluxe has M008 and M108, also 'cannot be identified'
My car has a locking decklid handle, I have been told this may not have been a standard spec and was an optional extra. None of my other M codes relate to this....could it be 008 or 108, anyone else got a lockable 'T' handle?
Posted by: VW Stan - 13 January 2009 14:55:55
[quote=harveypj]
My RHD 58 Deluxe has M008 and M108, also 'cannot be identified'
My car has a locking decklid handle, I have been told this may not have been a standard spec and was an optional extra. None of my other M codes relate to this....could it be 008 or 108, anyone else got a lockable 'T' handle?
[/quote]
Nope, mine is non-locking!
:?
Posted by: harveypj - 13 January 2009 15:07:52
it puzzles me that with the amount of cars that VW made, they cannot identify all M codes, they were kind of key to every car they made, ensuring it met with the customers spec and local road laws.:?
Posted by: VW Stan - 13 January 2009 15:13:50
As M 001 is the code for the external chrome package on a UK Export Standard,
Perhaps one of the other unknown M codes is for the UK spec interior, which is again different from the German domestic market standards?
:roll:
Posted by: RoRoVw - 13 January 2009 16:33:19
The reason Blendfunctionwithform's '55 standard doesn't have any sunvisors (or the correct interior mirror) is that they were stolen from the car whilst it was displayed at a show - or so I was told by its previous owner! Presumably it would have had a single, green perspex visor and accompanying mirror when supplied by VW.
My 1971 1200 also has M008 - cannot be identified. It doesn't have a locking engine lid either. It also has M061 which cannot be identified.
Posted by: VW Stan - 13 January 2009 19:40:27
[quote=RoRoVw]The reason Blendfunctionwithform's '55 standard doesn't have any sunvisors (or the correct interior mirror) is that they were stolen from the car whilst it was displayed at a show - or so I was told by its previous owner! Presumably it would have had a single, green perspex visor and accompanying mirror when supplied by VW.
My 1971 1200 also has M008 - cannot be identified. It doesn't have a locking engine lid either. It also has M061 which cannot be identified.[/quote]
Do you have a birth cert for your 60 std?
Any M codes on that one?
:d
Posted by: blendfunctionwithform - 13 January 2009 21:14:06
Thank you foir the nice comments, RoRovw you are correct that is what i was told by the previuos owner although, on my birth certificate it states that the car was ordered with optional extra passenger sunvisor aswell.
Ps I have a locking T bar engine lid handle.
Posted by: RoRoVw - 14 January 2009 08:56:35
[quote=VW Stan]
Do you have a birth cert for your 60 std?
Any M codes on that one?
:d
[/quote]
No I haven't sent for it's Birth Certificate, I must get on with that! It does have an early version of the certificate from years ago which only states it was built on 8th April 1960 and delivered to the UK on 13th April. No M codes are quoted.
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 14 January 2009 11:25:46
M008 and M108 seem to appear on every RHD deluxe as options. I reckon these were internal factory codes for the RHD parts (mirror, RHD visor, floor mats, drop arm, pedal cluster, floor mats etc). These codes are never listed in any M codes literature.
Posted by: VW Stan - 14 January 2009 11:37:02
[quote=Rich Oakley]M008 and M108 seem to appear on every RHD deluxe as options. I reckon these were internal factory codes for the RHD parts (mirror, RHD visor, floor mats, drop arm, pedal cluster, floor mats etc). These codes are never listed in any M codes literature.[/quote]
Could well be but wouldn't you expect there to be different M codes for RHD Standards?
which have different mirrors, floor mats, pedal cluster etc!
:?
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 14 January 2009 20:29:01
[quote=VW Stan]
Could well be but wouldn't you expect there to be different M codes for RHD Standards?
which have different mirrors, floor mats, pedal cluster etc!
:?
[/quote]
Good point Malc.
Do these M008 and M108 codes ever show up on LHD car's certificates? I haven't owned many LHD cars.
Posted by: VW Stan - 15 January 2009 16:28:01
[quote=Rich Oakley]
Good point Malc.
Do these M008 and M108 codes ever show up on LHD car's certificates? I haven't owned many LHD cars.[/quote]
Sound like a a good one for 48REME...
What are the M codes on your LHD Std?
:d
Posted by: 54 Gertie - 15 January 2009 17:37:04
[quote=harveypj]
My RHD 58 Deluxe has M008 and M108, also 'cannot be identified'
My car has a locking decklid handle, I have been told this may not have been a standard spec and was an optional extra. None of my other M codes relate to this....could it be 008 or 108, anyone else got a lockable 'T' handle?
[/quote]
Have literally this morning had our RHD UK 55s certificate from wolfsburg and guess what.......
M008, M108 cannot be identified:evil:
Our cars T handle is the non locking type and im sure it original due to the fact that we have all the invoices for all the parts on it! from the mid/late 50s to when it was stored in 87 and it is not on there as being replaced!
BTW what is a M018, large reflector in brake/indicator light? Ive seen it on German, swedish, Belgian, usa and UK cars, what is it?
Also it says "colour-not mentioned"????????? Im sure it was originally texas brown due to pictures of it in original apint in the 70s and the fact that we have the original semaphores (in bits:evil: ) but in og paint! Just wondering if this is common?
Posted by: mrmagyar - 15 January 2009 18:29:11
Hi,
The Birth Certificate for my '55, apart from the unidentified M 008 and M 108, also states 'colour not mentioned'. Maybe in those days they didn't make a note of the colour of the car. The engine number isn't given either, it just states '30hp, 1,2 litre'.
Posted by: RoRoVw - 15 January 2009 18:45:46
Wolfsburg must have been busy sending out Birth Certificates as I've received one today as well. This is for a 1959 Deluxe built on 1st July. The certificate lists M020 - mph speedometer and then all unknown - 008, 042, 108, 135, 600.
Now this car was originally ordered with a passenger sun visor and a front antiroll bar as extras and these are listed on the original invoice. Would these two be the M135 and M600??
Posted by: 54 Gertie - 15 January 2009 19:05:06
[quote=RoRoVw]Wolfsburg must have been busy sending out Birth Certificates as I've received one today as well. This is for a 1959 Deluxe built on 1st July. The certificate lists M020 - mph speedometer and then all unknown - 008, 042, 108, 135, 600.
Now this car was originally ordered with a passenger sun visor and a front antiroll bar as extras and these are listed on the original invoice. Would these two be the M135 and M600??[/quote]
Hi Rob!:d
On ours M042 is "complies with british markets regulations"
I suppose all UK cars had this! :wink:
I asked if we could be told the original engine number but she said that because of data protection they could not tell me, they said that if I supplied them with a number that I thought be the original that they would confirm it for me! I only found the original number after they had done the research!:roll: :evil:
So on ours it just say under engine "30 DIN-PS, 1.2 Liter"
Posted by: RoRoVw - 15 January 2009 19:08:39
Hi Will,
Thanks for that. Strange how they know a code for one car and don't know the same one for another. Doh!
Rob
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 15 January 2009 19:10:40
One of the problems with obtaining information for the birth certificates is that they are apparently still reading the information from the original ledgers, which are getting fragile. On at least three occasions now, I've heard that people have not been able to get data on their car because of the poor condition of the original factory documents. This may be why 'colour not known' appears on some certificates.
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 15 January 2009 19:12:43
I've just checked my 59's birth certificate and it also has M135 not identified (as well as M008, M042 and M108). My car did not come with a passenger sunvisor though and had a non-locking T-handle.
Posted by: RoRoVw - 15 January 2009 19:16:35
Oh well it was just a thought. Thanks for that. Perhaps it's a strange code peculiar to Garnet Red cars only!
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 15 January 2009 19:20:44
[quote=RoRoVw]Oh well it was just a thought. Thanks for that. Perhaps it's a strange code peculiar to Garnet Red cars only![/quote]
Have you bought Tim's car by any chance??
Posted by: 54 Gertie - 15 January 2009 19:23:12
[quote=RoRoVw]Oh well it was just a thought. Thanks for that. Perhaps it's a strange code peculiar to Garnet Red cars only![/quote]
Oooooh Garnet Red!:beer: One of my goals in life to own a Garnet 58 rhd uk bug (im not picky or anything:lol: )
Pictures, pictures, pictures!8) :wink:
Posted by: RoRoVw - 15 January 2009 19:27:14
Yes it was Tim's car.
Virtually the longest journey it's made was the 286 miles from Portsmouth back to Yorkshire in torrential rain all the way. At least it kept it clean underneath! [ATTACH]2401[/Attach]
Posted by: Rich Oakley - 15 January 2009 19:42:45
[quote=RoRoVw]Yes it was Tim's car.
Virtually the longest journey it's made was the 286 miles from Portsmouth back to Yorkshire in torrential rain all the way. At least it kept it clean underneath![/quote]
One of my favourite cars of all time! That car inspired me to go out and find a RHD British Garnet Red car. I searched for ages before buying mine in 1997. Not many RHD Garnets left.
Posted by: 54 Gertie - 15 January 2009 19:43:35
I've always loved that one!:d :beer:
Posted by: RoRoVw - 15 January 2009 19:53:12
No there don't seem to be many Garnet Reds out there.
I've bought the car in co-ownership with another local enthusiast. It will certainly be seen out and about at shows this year, probably starting with Stanford Hall. We've a few mechanical jobs to do on it before it travels any distance again but hopefully we can sort the problems out fairly quickly.
The comprehensive history files are compulsive reading. Every journey between collection from Colbornes in Ripley in 1959 and the original owners selling it to Tim in 1988 are logged in two books. I've managed to cross reference journeys the car made in 1960 with meetings of the VWOCGB reported in early copies of 'Beetling' magazine proving that the car was actually at the meetings. I'm sure more will emerge as I read on!
Posted by: Ovalbug - 15 January 2009 20:47:39
[quote=54 Gertie]
I asked if we could be told the original engine number but she said that because of data protection they could not tell me, they said that if I supplied them with a number that I thought be the original that they would confirm it for me! I only found the original number after they had done the research!:roll: :evil:
So on ours it just say under engine "30 DIN-PS, 1.2 Liter"[/quote]
I had a similar experience when getting the Birth Certificate for my '53; knew the factory engine number as the 25bhp lump is still with the car but didn't include it with my application as assumed they would list it :roll: .
Certificate arrived with engine number not included , so I re-emailed the AutoMuseum giving them the number and they sent a revised BC out straight away :d .
Posted by: harveypj - 15 January 2009 21:52:47
I found out about the engine / data protection thing before I sent of for my cert.
If you give them your engine number a covering letter will come with your cert.
Mine reads after a paragraph of blurb explaining the data protection issue;
your car with chassis number # ### ###
has the original engine number ### ###
not sure how it would read if it were not the original engine tho?
:idea: Maybe its time Rob added M codes to the 'numbers/codes' section.
Posted by: IN2VWS - 16 January 2009 11:35:17
[quote=Rich Oakley]I've just checked my 59's birth certificate and it also has M135 not identified (as well as M008, M042 and M108). My car did not come with a passenger sunvisor though and had a non-locking T-handle.[/quote]
M135 = Leatherette seats.
Posted by: harveypj - 16 January 2009 13:47:00
[quote=IN2VWS]
M135 = Leatherette seats.[/quote]
I have M079 'Upholstery leatherette instead of material'
colour (L334 firn blue) is marked with a *
then at the very bottom of the cert * Upholstery leatherette Blue Grey
What colour is your car / interior?
Posted by: 54 Gertie - 16 January 2009 17:41:57
[quote=harveypj]
I have M079 'Upholstery leatherette instead of material'
[/quote]
Same! Our interior is the brown vinyl type that you get in Ultramaroon, texas brown, black and a few others!
Will
Posted by: Bally - 16 January 2009 19:56:55
[quote=Rich Oakley]One of the problems with obtaining information for the birth certificates is that they are apparently still reading the information from the original ledgers, which are getting fragile. On at least three occasions now, I've heard that people have not been able to get data on their car because of the poor condition of the original factory documents. This may be why 'colour not known' appears on some certificates. [/quote]
My December '55 car is one of those that they couldn't date for me as the micro fiche was disintegrating "[i]we are not able to research the data of your car because the micro fish regarding the chassis number of your car is crumbling and illegible[/i]"
I was wondering if any of the 55 Birth Certificates coming through this week are for December 55 and if that therefore means they have managed to resolve this issue? Can anyone confirm or deny they have had a Dec 55 BC please?
I'm pretty sure my car was Inca red when new (someone has written it in ink on the old reg document from when it was imported in 66) but it has had at least two resprays since then so I cannot be completely sure. I'd like to get it back to its original colour some day...
Thanks,
Dave
Posted by: IN2VWS - 16 January 2009 20:16:40
[quote=harveypj]
I have M079 'Upholstery leatherette instead of material'
colour (L334 firn blue) is marked with a *
then at the very bottom of the cert * Upholstery leatherette Blue Grey
What colour is your car / interior?[/quote]
That is also correct. In the 1950's and early 1960's, M079, M104, M134 and M135 were leatherette options for sedans. M909 and M918 were leatherette options for verts.
https://www.in2vws.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=14&Itemid=44
This list is far from complete, but it only contains proven correct M codes for pre 67 cars. I have also listed the source for each entry on that page.
I am sure the VW Museum has the correct info, but they don't know where to look, or are too lazy to look. Shit....If I can find them in my VW literature, surely the museum can find them. I am sure their library is 10 or 100 times larger than mine.
A lot of the M codes the museum gives for 1950's and 1960's VW's, is taken from a 1973 VW publication that lists the current M codes of that time, and they are not applicable to the early cars.
John
Posted by: VW Stan - 22 January 2009 14:29:39
I now know what M 063 is!
It's the code for the Jupiter grey imitation leather material on UK Standards which replaces the cloth found on Domestic standards!
Tick that one off the list!
[ATTACH]2413[/Attach]
Posted by: RoRoVw - 22 January 2009 16:15:49
Now that's really interesting. Thanks for sharing that piece of information.
Excellent!
That sheet also shows that the carpet in the front was a different shade from the one in the luggage area - something which you commented on when you photographed my car at the NEC.
Posted by: VW Stan - 22 January 2009 17:08:57
[quote=RoRoVw]Now that's really interesting. Thanks for sharing that piece of information.
Excellent!
That sheet also shows that the carpet in the front was a different shade from the one in the luggage area - something which you commented on when you photographed my car at the NEC.[/quote]
Yep, seems deluxe 58s had different colour carpets front and back as well which I never knew!
:d
[ATTACH]2414[/Attach]
Posted by: RoRoVw - 22 January 2009 18:18:41
Yes and 1959 too. The Garnet Red Deluxe which I and a friend have recently bought has very obviously different carpet shades front and back.
